Where have the 7608 gone????

[wheels]

I am surprised that as many as 300+ people objected to the ASDA/CAMSFC planning application given the startling collapse in practical support for MIA. (1000+ marching in August 2011, 100+ marching in September  2012). Of course the 2011 march was in those halcyon days when there were no facts and a campaign could be safely influenced by rumours, hyperbole, and falsehoods, those “the size of the supermarket will be the size of six football pitches and don’t let them tell you any different” or “this will involve demolishing the swimming baths” or “our volunteer emergency services personnel will be massively hindered in turning out to emergency calls from the public.. literally lives could be put at risk” days, the days when 85% of the petition signatures were obtained.

Things changed dramatically when the consultation period started and it became necessary to deal with facts. The downscaling of the “petition” presentation from the plan for a ceremony on the steps of 10 Downing Street proudly announced at the SMBC Area Committee meeting last August, and enthusiastically supported by councilors Candler, Wright, and Alexander, to a rather to a more modest event at Stockport with no elected representative appearing in the publicity photo is symptomatic of the problems faced by the campaign when reality inconveniently set in

Good post

[alstan]

I am surprised that as many as 300+ people objected to the ASDA/CAMSFC planning application given the startling collapse in practical support for MIA. (1000+ marching in August 2011, 100+ marching in September  2012). Of course the 2011 march was in those halcyon days when there were no facts and a campaign could be safely influenced by rumours, hyperbole, and falsehoods, those “the size of the supermarket will be the size of six football pitches and don’t let them tell you any different” or “this will involve demolishing the swimming baths” or “our volunteer emergency services personnel will be massively hindered in turning out to emergency calls from the public.. literally lives could be put at risk” days, the days when 85% of the petition signatures were obtained.

Things changed dramatically when the consultation period started and it became necessary to deal with facts. The downscaling of the “petition” presentation from the plan for a ceremony on the steps of 10 Downing Street proudly announced at the SMBC Area Committee meeting last August, and enthusiastically supported by councilors Candler, Wright, and Alexander, to a rather to a more modest event at Stockport with no elected representative appearing in the publicity photo is symptomatic of the problems faced by the campaign when reality inconveniently set in

[Dave]

Jethroh, I take your point about the large number of objections to the planning application, compared with the relatively small number of supporting responses. But that is a different issue. The fact remains that MIA wrote 'the majority of people in Marple oppose that development.' They do not have any evidence to support that claim.

[jethroh65]

also 8,000 person petition 

I dispute this. They cannot take it into account surely.. It was started BEFORE plans were public and was based on scaremongering about knocking down the swimming baths, it was claimed to be a Tesco Extra etc. Three of my own family members signed it but now support Asda. On the basis of that being taken into account it would be a scandal. People have already written to the council to protest against this being used.

OK Ignore the petition.Of the people that have responded to the planning application, the overwhelming majority are against the plans. 

[marplex]

Unpopularity is not grounds for refusal of planning permission. A proper reason for refusal of planning permission must be based on the tangible harm which would be brought about by the proposal, as reflected in a relevant policy or other matter relating to planning, and in order to protect the public interest.

[JMC]

also 8,000 person petition 

I dispute this. They cannot take it into account surely.. It was started BEFORE plans were public and was based on scaremongering about knocking down the swimming baths, it was claimed to be a Tesco Extra etc. Three of my own family members signed it but now support Asda. On the basis of that being taken into account it would be a scandal. People have already written to the council to protest against this being used.

[jethroh65]

I agree entirely jethroh. But it's MIA who claim that 'the majority of people in Marple oppose that development'. But AFAIK there is no reliable information as to the majority view of residents on this issue. We simply don't know what the majority view is.

Given 392 have objected & 58 in favour, the planning committee has to conclude that the majority are against. In the same way that we elected our GMP police commissioner on a 14% turnout. On what basis can the planning committee gauge public opinion? They can only use evidence put before them i.e. Majority of responses are against & also 8,000 person petition, they can't assume or guess there is a silent majority.
The silent majority have had plenty of opportunity to present a petition and to show their public support, no excuses.   

 

[marplex]

I think it is generally accepted that only people who have a objection will voice their concern and those that don't will remain silent. Also given that all the campaigning by MIA including everything posted on this web site only encouraged you to register an objection, I have not seen anywhere that you could register a vote in favour of Asda I think therefore that it speaks volumes that 50 odd people did in fact bother to register a vote in favour and only 300 odd against.

I am in favour of Asda because I think Marple needs it and I believe this confirms the silent majority do also.

[amazon]

My in laws were asked to sign recently. They said they were from a place 5 hours away and were told it didn't matter. The in laws replied that they were in support of Asda anyway. I can only speak from my own friends, family and aquaintences but I find that there were more against it originally when MIA were spouting about losing the swimming baths, huge tescos etc. When the truth came out most people simply weren't bothered either way unless they lived nearby or own a business they fear will be affected. I found this the case even with people who were very opposed originally. Problem is the more shops die out and nothing comes in more people will have to go to Stockport etc for things and Marple will lose out.

Thank you JMC there are quite a few shops in marple that are for sale with no boards up stating so if those shops were to close because they can't sell marple could soon become a quite empty place . Then perhaps people would relise if ASDA don't come what they have done .

[JMC]

My in laws were asked to sign recently. They said they were from a place 5 hours away and were told it didn't matter. The in laws replied that they were in support of Asda anyway. I can only speak from my own friends, family and aquaintences but I find that there were more against it originally when MIA were spouting about losing the swimming baths, huge tescos etc. When the truth came out most people simply weren't bothered either way unless they lived nearby or own a business they fear will be affected. I found this the case even with people who were very opposed originally. Problem is the more shops die out and nothing comes in more people will have to go to Stockport etc for things and Marple will lose out.

[amazon]

It's not easy to make sense of, is it.    However, my guess is that the addresses in capitals, which have a date in the column on the left headed 'Consultation Letter Sent', are those near the site who were automatically sent a neighbour consultation letter.  The other addresses are mostly in lower case, and without a date beside them, and those are the responses from the rest of us.  I scrolled down and eventually found mine, and I had responded electronically on the council website.

Glad to see I'm on with my neighbor two votes for Asda

Look at some of the addresses one from leyland and Hyde  ,as I said a the time. A lot won't be from round hear .fidling the list

Wow Amazon, How do you know how they voted? Do tell.

Idont say I new how they voted I said months ago that a lot of people won't be from marple and I was right .

[Tricky]

MIA gave plenty of notice about the ways to complain and the time constraints etc.

Surely this shows the majority couldn't be bothered to object..

A small number objected and some people felt compelled to mail in support.

[Dave]

I agree entirely jethroh. But it's MIA who claim that 'the majority of people in Marple oppose that development'. But AFAIK there is no reliable information as to the majority view of residents on this issue. We simply don't know what the majority view is.

[jethroh65]

In advance of the forthcoming Area Committee meeting on 6 February, I see that MIA have posted the following claim on the 'Latest News' thread:  'This is your opportunity to show the Councillors who remain neutral on the issue of a Hibbert Lane supermarket, that the majority of people in Marple oppose that development.'

The population of Marple is around 23,500.  392 people have objected to the planning application.  At the risk of stating the obvious, 392 is not a majority of 23,500.   

You could say out of a population of 23,500 only 58 want the store, that is certainly not a majority
In fact you could based on the responses 13% in favour & 87% against  
I presume that is not an accurate reflection ? or is it?
Figures can manipulated and "spun" in many ways to suit one's needs.

[sooty2]

I too responded by email and have no date in the "letter sent" column. My wife also responded, yet our address only appears once

I was told only one response per household.