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Who do you expect to vote for (no one can see your vote and you can change it any time).

DARRAN PALMER (UKIP)
LISA SMART (Liberal Democrat)
MICHAEL TAYLOR (Labour)
WILLIAM WRAGG (Conservative)
Don't Know Yet
Won't Vote
GRAHAM REID (Green Party)

Author Topic: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?  (Read 43076 times)

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wheels

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #43 on: April 08, 2015, 04:46:02 PM »
Well my understanding is that the NHS was a Liberal brainchild merely introduced by Labour.

But you miss my point totally doctors Consultants and GP s have for many years milked the NHS indeed we might argue that we don't have an National HS but rather a set of fragmented services which come together under one banner but which are certainly not one service. GPs are essential private business charging what might be considered well over the odds for their services. Indeed the last Labour Govt rewarded them excessively  at the expense of the  patients.

So no I don't trust the view of those who have been shown to be the major beneficiaries of the service.


tigerman

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #42 on: April 08, 2015, 04:29:28 PM »
What a cynical response from Wheels.  To be sure, the Tories and doctors opposed Labour's setting up of the NHS after the war, but to put one's head in the sand regarding this warning by 100 health professionals is bizarre. The Tories are now desperately trying to up their offer to the electorate, but cannot be trusted.  There will be challenges galore ahead, but the Conservative's only desire is to cherry-pick services for sale to their financial mates and backers. The LibDems have colluded with them and have shown their hand. The NHS is Labour's brainchild and Labour remains our best hope of saving it.

wheels

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #41 on: April 08, 2015, 04:07:59 PM »
Yes they can be wrong and are in fact the major beneficiary's of the health service, regularly holding it to ramson.

Trust no one particularly ex local giovernment officers

marplerambler

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #40 on: April 08, 2015, 04:03:58 PM »
A fair point.
..... but can all of the doctors be wrong?


Senior doctors assess government’s record on NHS – letter to Guardian in full

More than 100 senior health professionals write in a personal capacity outlining their view of how the NHS in England has fared under the coalition

Letters

Tuesday 7 April 2015 19.29 BST  Last modified on Wednesday 8 April 2015 00.06 BST 


After five years of a government which pledged to protect the NHS, this election campaign makes it timely to assess its stewardship, since 2010, of England’s most precious institution. Our verdict, as doctors working in and for the NHS, is that history will judge that this administration’s record is characterised by broken promises, reductions in necessary funding, and destructive legislation, which leaves health services weaker, more fragmented, and less able to perform their vital role than at any time in the NHS’s history.

In short, the coalition has failed to keep its NHS pledges.

The 2012 Health and Social Care Act is already leading to the rapid and unwanted expansion of the role of commercial companies in the NHS. Lansley’s Act is denationalising healthcare because the abolition of the duty to provide an NHS throughout England abdicates government responsibility for universal services to ad hoc bodies (such as clinical commissioning groups) and competitive markets controlled by private-sector-dominated quangos.

In particular, the squeeze on services is hitting patients. People may be unaware that under the coalition, dozens of Accident & Emergency departments and maternity units have been closed or earmarked for closure or downgrading. In addition, 51 NHS walk-in centres have been closed or downgraded in this time, and more than 60 ambulance stations have shut and more than 100 general practices are at risk of closure.

The core infrastructure of the NHS is also being eroded with the closure of hospitals and thousands of NHS beds since 2010.

Mental health and primary care are faring no better – with both in disarray due to funding cuts and multiple reorganisations driven by ideology, not what works. Public health has been wrenched out of the NHS, where it held the ring for coordinated and equitable services for so long.

In September 2014, the Royal College of General Practitioners said that the wait to see a GP is a “national crisis”.

In England the waiting list to see a specialist stands at 3 million people, and in December 2014 NHS England estimated that nearly 250,000 more patients were waiting for treatment across England who are not on the official waiting list.

Throughout England, patients have been left queueing in ambulances and NHS trusts have resorted to erecting tents in hospital car parks to deal with unmet need.

A&E target waiting times have not been met for a year, and are at the worst levels for more than a decade; and elderly, vulnerable patients are marooned in hospital because our colleagues in social care have no money or staff to provide much-needed services at home.

Funding reductions for local authorities (in some places reductions as high as 40%) have undermined the viability of many local authority social care services across England. This has resulted in more patients arriving at A&E and more patients trapped in hospital as the necessary social care support needed to ensure their safe discharge is no longer there.

The NHS is withering away, and if things carry on as they are then in future people will be denied care they once had under the NHS and have to pay more for health services. Privatisation not only threatens coordinated services but also jeopardises training of our future healthcare providers and medical research, particularly that of public health.

Given the obvious pressures on the NHS over the last five years, and growing public concern that health services now facing a very uncertain future, we are left with little doubt that the current government’s policies have undermined and weakened the NHS.

The way forward is clear: abolish all the damaging sections of the Health and Social Care Act 2012 that fragment care and push the NHS towards a market-driven, “out-for-tender” mentality where care is provided by the lowest bidder. Reversing this costly and inefficient market bureaucracy alone will save significant sums. Above all, the secretary of state’s duty to provide an NHS throughout England must be reinstated, as in Scotland and Wales.

As medical and public health professionals our primary concern is for all patients.

We invite voters to consider carefully how the NHS has fared over the last five years, and to use their vote to ensure that the NHS in England is reinstated.

Dr Sheila Abdullah general practitioner (retired)
Dr Sheila Adam former deputy chief medical officer for England
Dr Gwen Adshead consultant psychiatrist
Prof George Alberti emeritus Professor of Medicine, University of Newcastle
Dr James Anderson consultant psychiatrist
Prof Sabarantnam Arulkumaran former president Royal College of Obstetrics and Gynaecology
Prof John Ashton retired director of public health
Dr Ashok Atrey GP
Dr Helen Bailey physician in Sexual Health and HIV
Dr Arun Bakshi emeritus consultant physician, Isle of Man
Dr JS Bamrah consultant psychiatrist
Mr Dipak Banerjee retired consultant opthalmologist
Dr Roger Banks psychiatrist in intellectual disability, former vice-president Royal College of Psychiatrists
Dr Helen Bantock senior lecturer and consultant paediatrician
Dr David Bareford retired consultant haemotologist
Dr Vijay Bathla GP
Dr Naomi Beer GP partner
Prof Richard Bentall professor of clinical psychology, University of Liverpool
Dr Morris Bernadt retired consultant psychiatrist
Dr Naureen Bhatti GP and associate dean, London Professional Support Unit
Prof Dinesh Bhugra consultant psychiatrist and former president Royal College of Psychiatrists
Dr Christopher Birt University of Liverpool and Christie hospital, Manchester
Dr Kambiz Boomla GP and former chair City and East London Local Medical Committee
Dr Carol Brayne
Dr Raymond Brown consultant paediatrician
Dr Laurence Buckman GP and former chair UK General Practitioners Committee
Dr Chris Burns-Cox emeritus consultant physician, Bristol
Dr Marta Buszewicz GP and senior lecturer in general practice
Prof Simon Capewell professor of public health, University of Liverpool
Dr Lucy Carter GP
Dr Lyn Challands retired GP
Professor Sir Iain Chalmers coordinator, James Lind Initiative
Dr Kailash Chand GP and former NHS trust chair
Dr Connie Chen GP clinical lead for prescribing and child health, Central Manchester CCG
Prof Carolyn Chew-Graham
Dr Jonathan Coates GP
Dr Tom Coffee GP
Prof Michel Coleman professor of epidemiology
Prof Peter Crome emeritus professor
Dr Richard Cunningham consultant microbiologist
Dr Jack Czauderna retired GP
Dr Jonathan Dare retired consultant child and adolescent psychiatrist, Maudsley hospital
Dr Susan Davies consultant histopathologist
Dr Paquita de Zulueta honorary senior clinical lecturer, Imperial College London
Dr Nicholas Dennis retired, clinical genetics
Dr Harpal Dhingra GP, Albrighton
Professor Paola Domizio pathology education
Dr Edgar Dorman consultant obstetrician and gynaecologist, London
Dr Ross Dyer-Smith clinical lead, Lambeth CCG director
Dr David Elliman consultant, community child health
Dr Katrina Erskine consultant gynaecology and obstetrics, Homerton University hospital, London
Dr George Farrelly GP
Dr Katherine Fielder GP
Dr Miriam Fine accident and emergency
Dr Peter Fisher retired consultant physician
Dr Paul Fleming consultant anaesthetist
Dr Lindsay Forbes senior lecturer in cancer and public health
Prof Robbie Foy professor of primary care, University of Leeds
Dr Andrea Franks consultant dermatologist, Chester
Dr Robert Galloway accident and emergency
Prof Linda Gask emirita professor of primary care psychiatry, University Of Manchester
Dr Clare Gerada GP and former chair, Royal College of General Practitioners
Dr Colin Godber consultant old age psychiatry
Dr Michael Gopfert
Dr Marilyn Graham general practitioner
Prof Trisha Greenhalgh professor of primary care, University of Oxford
Dr Rex Haigh consultant psychiatrist in medical psychotherapy
Dr Phil Hammond associate specialist paediatric chronic fatigue service, Bath
Dr MG Harrington consultant geriatrician
Dr David Hawkins consultant physician
Dr Iona Heath GP and former president, Royal College Of General Practitioners
Dr Robert Hugo consultant psychiatrist
Dr Christopher Jenkins GP
Prof Roger Jones editor, British Journal of General Practice, emeritus professor of general practice, King’s College, London
Dr Coral Jones GP
Dr Fred Kavalier GP
Dr Mohammed Salah Khalifa GP
Dr Surendra Kumar GP
Dr Dianne Levevre consultant psychiatrist
Dr Jasvinder Singh Lidder consultant psychiatrist
Prof Karina Lovell professor of mental health
Dr Simon Lowes specialist registrar clinical radiology
Dr Sahira Mahmood locum GP
Dr Nick Mann GP and NHS osteopath
Dr Chris Manning convener Action for NHS Wellbeing
Prof Martin McKee professor of European public health
Dr Helene McKeon GP
Dr John Middleton independent public health physician
Dr Sally Mitchison retired consultant psychiatrist
Dr Roger Neighbour GP and former president, Royal College of General Practitioners
Dr Julia Nelki child psychiatrist Cheshire & Wirral Partnership Trust
Dr David Nicholl consultant neurologist
Dr Maureen O’Leary retired consultant psychiatrist
Dr Tony O’Sullivan consultant paediatrician, Kaleidoscope – Lewisham Centre for Children & Young People
Dr Sophia Osbourne GP
Dr David Owen
Dr Tim Paine former president, National Association for Patient Participation
Prof Allyson Pollock professor of public health
Prof Hilary Powers professor of nutritional biochemistry and head of oncology, University of Sheffield
Dr Umesh Prabhu consultant paediatrician
Dr Braham Prashara GP
Dr Shibley Rahman academic in dementia, Primrose Hill
Dr Dan Rainbow GP and locality commissioner
Anne Read consultant psychiatrist
Dr Paul Revell consultant haematologist
Dr Brian Rossiter retired consultant physician
Dr Yvette Saldanha GP trainer
Dr Alex Samuel senior lecturer in public health, University of Liverpool
Professor Wendy Savage retired senior lecturer in obstetrics and gynaecology
Dr Gabriele Scally public health consultant
Dr Parveen Sharma consultant psychiatrist
Mr Virender Sharma consultant ENT Surgeon
Dr Caroline Shulman GP for homeless and inclusion health, Kings Health Partners
Dr Kamal Sidhu GP
Dr Martin Siebert GP
Dr Brian Silk
Dr Ian Sinclair general practitioner (retired)
Dr Surinder Singh GP
Dr Francis Skiffington retired consultant community paediatrican
Dr Alison Smailes GP
Dr Donatella Soldi community paediatrician
Mr Virender Soni ophthalmologist
Dr Miranda Splitt consultant geriatrician
Dr John Sweeney consultant physician
Dr RL Symonds consultant psychiatrist
Prof Raymond Tallis emeritus professor of geriatric medicine, University of Manchester
Dr Jonathon Tomlinson GP
Dr Charlie Tomson consultant nephrologist
Dr David Tomson GP
Dr Norman Traub former consultant haematologist, Southend hospital
Dr Asha Umrawsingh emergency care doctor, Lewisham University hospital
Dr Devaraja Vedakkalur GP
Dr Ian Walton GP
Dr Fiona Watson GP
Dr Eric Watts retired consultant haemotologist and clinical director
Prof Jonathon Weber professor of infectious diseases, Imperial College London
Dr Tara Weeramanthri GP
Dr Sian Williams consultant in occupational medicine
Dr David Wrigley GP
Dr Luke Zander retired GP
Dr Patrick Zentler-Munro retired consultant physician

wheels

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #39 on: April 08, 2015, 12:59:08 PM »
So you trust unaccountable politicans who work for 38 degrees but not those electable and accountable. Strange

marplerambler

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #38 on: April 08, 2015, 12:22:54 PM »
Well I never! Just had my rant about tne political parties and the NHS and look what has appeared in my emails from 38degrees:

We’ve just caught a glimpse of the worst case scenario for our NHS. One of Britain’s leading doctors has just said that patients could have to pay for basic medical care after the election. He’s warning that politicians could “destroy the ultimate ethos of the NHS” by introducing fees and charges for NHS services like GP appointments. [1]

Our NHS was founded on the belief that everyone - rich or poor - should get the care they need. That principle is now in danger.

A huge petition now could force all political parties to promise they’ll never introduce charges in the NHS. If 38 Degrees members kick up a huge fuss now, parties will know they can’t sneak this through. But we haven’t got long to get them to rule this out - in the next few days, parties will be deciding on their final election promises. This could be one of them. Will you add your name?


SIGN THE PETITION


We rely on the NHS at the best and worst moments of our life. It has to be free at the point of use so it’s there for us all when we need it. Imagine waiting until payday to make a GP appointment for your child, or taking out a bank loan to have cancer treatment. That’s not the NHS as we know it.

Every single signature on the petition means more pressure on politicians to rule out charging us for healthcare. They know the public won't stand for broken election promises. If we can force party leaders to promise to rule out NHS charges now, we can hold them to it later.

Please sign the petition now to keep our NHS free when we need it:


SIGN THE PETITION


Thanks for being involved,

Amy, Bex, India, Laura and the 38 Degrees team


marplerambler

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #37 on: April 08, 2015, 11:20:41 AM »
We all know that the odds are set, so that the bookies see a profit whatever the outcome is.   Therefore the odds are a reflection of the view of people that bet.

So how much does this tell us about the money management ability of labor supporter?

It tells us a great deal more about the money management ability of the bookies.

There are only three certainties in life: death, taxes and that the bookie always wins.

Death and illness amongst  the poorer in society will come earlier if the Tories win due to moving Conservative goalposts which will shift responsibility for healthcare and care of the elderly from the state to the individual as a way of rewarding a lifetime of paying taxes and National Insurance Contributions.  If you become ill, illness will become a way that private health companies which are propping up the Conservative Party will bleed you and what remains of the NHS dry. If you become ill, the Conservatives have no conscience about replacing professional nurses with carers on zero-hour contracts . NHS waiting times will be so long you will be driven to the point of absolute despair into the hands of American style private hospitals if you need an artificial hip or if you are waiting treatment for a painful but non-life threatening condition. If the Conservatives remain in power Cameron will achieve his ultimate objective of balancing the books by ensuring that the only way into Stepping Hill will be via a trolley from an ambulance into intensive care but it is then that you will then receive the  generally fantastic level of care that the NHS staff (if not the Government) are willing to offer. The only problem about this is that prevention is better than cure. We need easier access to our GPs (abominable in Marple) and shorter waiting lists for subsequent care which prevents conditions becoming critical.

Labour should admit that tax increases are inevitable if the NHS is to survive and provide a satisfactory service. Labour should state that any NHS services which are privatised will be immediately nationalised and taken back into the NHS fold with no compensation to those companies which annex parts of the NHS but which ultimately see the sick as a source of profits.

As desirable as it is to keep out the Tories, no-one should now believe the LibDems offer a future. The solemn pledge made by the LibDems at the last election and which is now being made yet again is that you must vote LibDem to keep out the Tories. This was the solemn pledge made by Andrew Stunnell prior to the last election and his first action as an MP was to integrate into the LibDems into the Conservative Party to facilitate destruction of public services for five years. He has now received his knighthood for his betrayal of the people of Marple . The yellow diamonds are popping up but I am incredulous that anyone should ever be willing to trust the LibDems again.

Perhaps Ladbrookes should be putting up a candidate. You can be sure that they will not only balance the books, they will still have people stupid enough to be propping up their business in five years time in the same way as people in Marple seem to stupid enough to continue to support the LibDems. There has been absolutely nothing to inspire from the established political parties. Could Ladbrookes do any worse?


Disgusted of Marple

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #36 on: April 07, 2015, 11:19:02 PM »
Breaking news (well, four days ago but this is Marple!)... The Green Party have managed to cobble together the £500 and ten supporters needed for a nomination. Graham Reid is their man. I expect the intrepid newshounds on this board will be running background checks on his local credentials as we speak. I'm assuming he has some, unless it's a different Graham Reid to the Marple South 2014 local election candidate. Nominations close on Thursday at 4 p.m. if anyone else fancies their chances.

marpleexile

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #35 on: April 03, 2015, 11:35:03 AM »

Mind you, many years ago, when I was (briefly) a member of a political party, I did some door-to-door canvassing at an election.  It was very interesting, in all sorts of ways.  I came across people who genuinely didn't understand the difference between voting for an MP and a councillor.  And then there were those who believed that voting was like betting - that you voted for the candidate who you thought was most likely to win! 


There are two Churchill quotes that spring to mind:

Quote from: Winston Churchill
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

Which leads to:

Quote from: Winston Churchill
Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others.

Dave

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #34 on: April 03, 2015, 10:09:18 AM »
I've been scratching my head over that post for several days, but I'm still none the wiser!   :-\

Ringi seems to be suggesting that people who bet at elections are betting on the party they happen to support.  But supporting a party is one thing, whilst expecting it to win is quite another!

Mind you, many years ago, when I was (briefly) a member of a political party, I did some door-to-door canvassing at an election.  It was very interesting, in all sorts of ways.  I came across people who genuinely didn't understand the difference between voting for an MP and a councillor.  And then there were those who believed that voting was like betting - that you voted for the candidate who you thought was most likely to win! 

Meanwhile, having watched last night's seven-sided political debate on the telly, I'm wondering whether it's too late for us to have an SNP candidate in Hazel Grove.   ;)

ringi

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #33 on: March 31, 2015, 10:52:44 PM »
Sorry wheels, but only Coral are suggesting that.  See http://www.oddschecker.com/politics/british-politics/next-uk-general-election/next-government

The vast majority of the bookies, as that link shows, are expecting a Labour minority government.

We all know that the odds are set, so that the bookies see a profit whatever the outcome is.   Therefore the odds are a reflection of the view of people that bet.

So how much does this tell us about the money management ability of labor supporter?

Dave

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #32 on: March 31, 2015, 01:35:32 PM »
Sorry wheels, but only Coral are suggesting that.  See http://www.oddschecker.com/politics/british-politics/next-uk-general-election/next-government

The vast majority of the bookies, as that link shows, are expecting a Labour minority government.

wheels

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #31 on: March 31, 2015, 12:32:56 PM »
I know your keen on quoting bookies odds Dave. I see now the bookies are saying that the Lib Dems will be part of the next government. Interesting development from the suggested whip out.

Dave

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #30 on: March 31, 2015, 12:01:10 PM »
Indeed. And the strategy of vilifying Miliband is revealing, isn't it. It tells us that the Tories are rattled. They think they should be ahead in the opinion polls by now, but they aren't.

A smarter strategy, IMHO, might have been to ignore Miliband, and to just be statesmanlike and visionary, implying that Labour are insignificant and irrelevant. Instead, the Tories are showing that they are scared.

simonesaffron

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Re: Who are the candidates and who's got your vote?
« Reply #29 on: March 31, 2015, 11:30:56 AM »
I think that Wheels makes a fair point and I agree, I haven't heard any either.

Which as Dave points out is more than can be said for the leadership. It seems to me that Cameron never stops threatening/criticising Miliband.