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Author Topic: Save Marple Wharf - the facts  (Read 1001 times)

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john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2019, 08:50:11 AM »
I mean, if there are houses involved I’m not going to object.
Parts of Marple Wharf are currently an 'eyesore', consequently many local residents consider new housing here will offer an immediate solution. I appeal to you and all like minded persons to 'face up to the facts'. This is a two hundred year old waterway which extends some twenty three miles at around 515 feet above sea level (the height of Blackpool Tower). Initially, the Wharf was built to assist with cost effective maintenance of this canal. If as is proposed it is to revert to high density housing, we will suffer the repercussions for ever more. For example, a few years ago when the twelve feet high retaining wall opposite the Wharf, running between Bridge 1 and Bridge 2 (and supporting the properties on Hollies Drive in the process) needed extensive repairs, a temporary dam was constructed across the canal hereabouts, enabling plant and materials to be transferred to the work site from the Wharf which was employed as a marshalling area. Were seven houses to be built directly on the Wharf, the only viable access to this retaining wall is via the towpath ramp on Bridge 1. Hence, future repairs could result in months of untold 'misery' for the residents of Lockside and Suttons Lane. Furthermore, this type of unpleasant 'scenario' could unfold at other waterside locations in Marple and its environs, compromising the quality of life of many of our residents.       

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #23 on: October 13, 2019, 10:24:48 AM »
Developement of the wharf will be little help to visiting boaters, as it is generally scheduled as a service point. What boaters do require are an increase in moorings within the area. The 48 hour moorings on the Peak Forest canal adjacent to the junction have been in a dire condition from many years with  collapsed banks and underwater obstructions. Developement of this would enhance the experience more for visiting boaters. Whatever is developed at the wharf it will only ever be a short stay service point for boaters, not alternative moorings.

I agree with you regarding the very poor condition of the (towpath) bank along the Upper Peak Forest Canal, where three major failures have occurred since 1941. Much of the the sheet piling used to line this length of canal is almost corroded through and needs immediate attention, particularly between Marple and Strines. Marple Wharf offers the ideal means of transferring the replacement sheet piling from a road vehicle to a work boat in order to undertake this extensive remedial work conveniently, so why build seven houses on it?  Without the Wharf CRT would have to make alternative arrangements which may well compromise those living nearby. For example the residents of Garth Road which was used for many months to access the site of the recent Lock 11 rebuild.   

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #22 on: October 12, 2019, 01:15:56 PM »
Pleased to see the warehouse is no longer due to be wasted as a single oversized home (and yes I’ve invested because a heritage hub for Marple’s canals would be a fantastic thing), but it’s disappointing the rest of the plan is unchanged.

Seeing the existing and fairly nice five new houses, it still seems overly greedy to try to squeeze seven into this plot, along with the boating facilities and space around the warehouse. In fact, the awful and inappropriate way the parking spaces are laid out (one car stuck behind another!) means the whole cul-de-sac will probably immediately become a mess of dumped cars and wheelie bins. Then there’s the New Horizons mooring, which seems really poorly placed along a long, narrow path considering its accessibility requirements.

They’d do well to drop one house, come up with a sensible parking layout and give the area a bit of breathing space if they actually want this to go through.

The planning reference is DC/074338. Meanwhile, best of luck to The Wharf project - I’m sure the naysayers will enjoy a coffee there one day amongst the increasing number of visitors to Marple.
 ;)
Were the Warehouse to be converted for community use it would be for the benefit of all. However, the current proposal is conditional on high density development of the Wharf area. Upon leaving school I served a six year Apprenticeship as a Draughtsman. This has enabled me to survey the Wharf and the surrounding area in some detail. Using this information I've hand crafted a scale model which indicates exactly how the seven houses and the new Boaters Facility Block sit in relation to the Warehouse (see photograph attachment). If you are able to view this you may well agree with me that dropping one house won't offer much benefit and that all these houses are misplaced in this location. I would welcome your comments (more photographs are available).

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2019, 11:17:25 AM »
Water and waste disposal is also available at Macclesfield.

Water, waste disposal and elsan available at Buxworth and Whaley Bridge, the direction most boaters go in.
Water & waste disposal is available at Macclesfield but the nearest complete Facilities Block is Bosley 16miles South. Many boats do head for Whaley/Buxworth but through traffic does not, hence Marple Boater Facilities are absolutely crucial. Castlefield Facilities are currently limited to water supply only. Between 4pm and 5pm yesterday two boats ascended Marple flight.

prestbury

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2019, 09:37:15 PM »
Whilst I appreciate your opinion, if we can convince others of the potential of this Wharf (a focal point to attract visiting boaters) and stave off this Planning Application at least we could estimate the costs of renovating this area. For example, were it to be restored, the historic Weigh House could serve as a base for those involved with New Horizons. The Wharf area in general is untidy and in need of a long overdue makeover, especially as it is approaching its Bi-centenary. Throughout the country those living alongside waterways have 'adopted' water front areas nearby and improved them. This is already happening in Marple and we should express our thanks to the residents' of Lockside who regularly tend the area beside the recently rebuilt Lock 15.

Developement of the wharf will be little help to visiting boaters, as it is generally scheduled as a service point. What boaters do require are an increase in moorings within the area. The 48 hour moorings on the Peak Forest canal adjacent to the junction have been in a dire condition from many years with  collapsed banks and underwater obstructions. Developement of this would enhance the experience more for visiting boaters. Whatever is developed at the wharf it will only ever be a short stay service point for boaters, not alternative moorings.

prestbury

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2019, 09:30:36 PM »

Boat movements currently approach six boats per hour in each direction (but not at present as the canal is closed at Bollington). Nationwide, CRT offer Boater Facilities (Drinking Water, Rubbish & Sewerage Disposal) at one day sailing intervals. Marple Facilities lie between Fairfield (East Manchester) and Bosley (South of Macclesfield).

Water and waste disposal is also available at Macclesfield.

Water, waste disposal and elsan available at Buxworth and Whaley Bridge, the direction most boaters go in.

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2019, 09:22:48 AM »
that sounds like a VERY long ROI and not necessarily for whoever funds it's redevelopment.
Whilst I appreciate your opinion, if we can convince others of the potential of this Wharf (a focal point to attract visiting boaters) and stave off this Planning Application at least we could estimate the costs of renovating this area. For example, were it to be restored, the historic Weigh House could serve as a base for those involved with New Horizons. The Wharf area in general is untidy and in need of a long overdue makeover, especially as it is approaching its Bi-centenary. Throughout the country those living alongside waterways have 'adopted' water front areas nearby and improved them. This is already happening in Marple and we should express our thanks to the residents' of Lockside who regularly tend the area beside the recently rebuilt Lock 15. 

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2019, 09:03:17 AM »
Looks like you have something to do with New horizons .
Of course, everyone who has something to do with Marple has something to do with New Horizons! It is a charity that is cherished by Marple people. We owe it to them to take care of them and so do CRT.

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2019, 05:22:27 PM »
To be blunt, there's already attempts to convert the Wharf building in the form of The Wharf Marple Project, and according to their Facebook page they're over a third of a way there for funding
 
Answer; Though the plan to convert the Warehouse for community use is a very laudable proposal it is part of a Planning Application whereby the Wharf will be eclipsed by high density housing.

Let's be blunt.  It's put your money where your mouth is time.  If you want that facility invest and make it happen.  If enough people do, then it will most likely happen.

Answer: If this Planning Application is successful we will be denied for ever more the opportunity to develop the Wharf for the benefit of Marple residents, no matter how much funding may become available in the future.

Me?  I'm skeptical that there's the demand/need for conversion to a heritage centre/cafe that needs to be satisfied.  But others feel differently, so good luck to them.  If they can raise the money and make it happen, that's fine by me.  And if they prove me wrong, even better.

Answer: I genuinely hope these answers help curb your scepticism. See also the information offered below.

But if they don't succeed, what's going to happen to that building?   I've said it before here and I'll say it again.  Attempting to block redevelopment at a planning level on the basis of "it could be used for" would be simply bonkers.  If the community can't raise the funds to open it up, then why would anyone else do it?  In such a situation, trying to block redevelopment would simply mean the building sits there rotting away.

Answer: No one wishes to save the Warehouse more than I do, but I'm very concerned about the irreversible consequences of this Planning Application.

As for facilities for boaters?  What facilities do you want?  And is there a demand/need from boaters for such facilities?  It's easy to say "we need this?" but I'd like evidence.  I'd like data please.

Answer: Boat movements currently approach six boats per hour in each direction (but not at present as the canal is closed at Bollington). Nationwide, CRT offer Boater Facilities (Drinking Water, Rubbish & Sewerage Disposal) at one day sailing intervals. Marple Facilities lie between Fairfield (East Manchester) and Bosley (South of Macclesfield).

Parking spaces for users?  Which users?  How many of them can't walk from the sizeable car parks already located in Marple?  If you're talking users of New Horizons, then be specific.  I can't see many people supporting general parking there myself.

Answer: On many Mornings, walking groups of 20+ who cross Bridge 1 headed for the hills would welcome a cafe & parking nearby. Seven new houses would force New Horizons passengers (many of whom are disadvantaged) to 'trudge' 75 metres along towpath hopefully avoiding boater hoses in the process. Still sceptical?!


Note from Admin: I've attempted to unravel the answers from the original comments here, I hope I've got it right. You can't just type your answers in the middle of a quote otherwise it is almost impossible for people reading it to figure out what is quote and what is reply.

jimblob

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2019, 04:19:13 PM »
Were the Wharf to be developed in a manner to attract passing boaters into Marple town centre, it would be of benefit to our shops, restaurants, public houses and our cinema. If the Wharf reverts to high density housing this is a missed opportunity for ever more.

that sounds like a VERY long ROI and not necessarily for whoever funds it's redevelopment.

john suggitt

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2019, 03:04:42 PM »
Way shops are closing in marple there wont be a lot to spend money on .

Were the Wharf to be developed in a manner to attract passing boaters into Marple town centre, it would be of benefit to our shops, restaurants, public houses and our cinema. If the Wharf reverts to high density housing this is a missed opportunity for ever more.

rsh

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2019, 09:57:26 AM »
Pleased to see the warehouse is no longer due to be wasted as a single oversized home (and yes I’ve invested because a heritage hub for Marple’s canals would be a fantastic thing), but it’s disappointing the rest of the plan is unchanged.

Seeing the existing and fairly nice five new houses, it still seems overly greedy to try to squeeze seven into this plot, along with the boating facilities and space around the warehouse. In fact, the awful and inappropriate way the parking spaces are laid out (one car stuck behind another!) means the whole cul-de-sac will probably immediately become a mess of dumped cars and wheelie bins. Then there’s the New Horizons mooring, which seems really poorly placed along a long, narrow path considering its accessibility requirements.

They’d do well to drop one house, come up with a sensible parking layout and give the area a bit of breathing space if they actually want this to go through.

The planning reference is DC/074338. Meanwhile, best of luck to The Wharf project - I’m sure the naysayers will enjoy a coffee there one day amongst the increasing number of visitors to Marple.  ;)

amazon

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2019, 09:39:14 PM »
No, it isn't a separate issue. Together, the Wharf and its buildings are an important site in Marple's history and there is only one Planning Application. It includes the conversion of the Warehouse but also the building of seven houses and all the associated facilities right next to the Warehouse.

We need the Planning Application to be refused again so that the Canal and River Trust realise that the people of Marple want the Wharf to be developed for their benefit: conversion of the Warehouse, provision of open space around the Warehouse, parking spaces for users, facilities for boaters and a yard for New Horizons (just like they already have).
it is a seperate issue if the wharf is sold to this consortium or the people who choose to invest there money in it .they will have nothing to do with the proposed houses that canal and river trust want to build on that site .it will then be a seperate issue .

amazon

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2019, 08:12:51 PM »
But with such dire transport links and access by car (yes car!) so appalling, it's not an attractive option to visit, work, live, shop, dine etc. If Marple is to retain it's heritage, that somehow has to be funded and for that, people need to spend money here and be able to get here. We can't have it all ways!
Way shops are closing in marple there wont be a lot to spend money on .

amazon

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Re: Save Marple Wharf - the facts
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2019, 05:36:45 PM »
No, it isn't a separate issue. Together, the Wharf and its buildings are an important site in Marple's history and there is only one Planning Application. It includes the conversion of the Warehouse but also the building of seven houses and all the associated facilities right next to the Warehouse.

We need the Planning Application to be refused again so that the Canal and River Trust realise that the people of Marple want the Wharf to be developed for their benefit: conversion of the Warehouse, provision of open space around the Warehouse, parking spaces for users, facilities for boaters and a yard for New Horizons (just like they already have).
Looks like you have something to do with New horizons .