Marple Website Community Calendar
Archive => Archived Boards => Local Elections and Council Matters => Topic started by: Mr Brock on April 26, 2016, 03:06:07 PM
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Lib Dems and Conservatives are trying to get Government funding to extend the Relief Road from Hazel Grove to Bredbury and the M60. What do local candidates of other parties think about this? There has been a serious lack of discussion about such a major project that will damage valued green spaces, most notably the Goyt Valley. It will cost upwards of half a billion which is public money that should be carefully used whether it comes from Government or Council. The onus should be on those proposing the scheme 1. to show that the endangered green spaces are not needed or valuable to Stockport, and 2. to prove that the new road will not be a further source of local congestion or become so bunged up after 10 or 15 years that yet another bypass will be needed. I hear that some Lib Dems are saying the Relief Road Extension is needed because the original A6-Airport Relief Road will send many more vehicles through Marple. I remember that the Marple Area Committee rubber-stamped the A6-Airport Relief Road despite being warned that it would increase congestion in Marple so I find the Lib Dem belated conversion to this view troubling. I recommend the May 8th Bluebell Walk by Goyt Valley SOS (2.30 outside Bredbury Hall – see www.facebook.com/GoytValleySOS/ ).
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I thought this road was all agreed before the Labour party stopped all road building in 1997. I understand that the golf course even moved several holes and greens to accommodate it.
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Personally,
I don't see more tarmac as being the answer to anything.
All that happens when we produce new roads is that after a period of time, they just add to the congestion. It's a cliché but more tarmac is just part of the problem and not part of the solution.
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As anyone who drives around this area knows, that road is desperately needed. I understand Kevin's point about the way new roads can cause more traffic, but on the other hand, something has to be done about the A6 at Hazel Grove, and the link will also reduce congestion at other bottlenecks, such as Bents Lane Bredbury.
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Partly we need to take tarmac away from private drivers on the A6……
For example as soon as the relief road opens, create a bus lane along the A6 in Hazel Grove.
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As anyone who drives around this area knows, that road is desperately needed. I understand Kevin's point about the way new roads can cause more traffic, but on the other hand, something has to be done about the A6 at Hazel Grove, and the link will also reduce congestion at other bottlenecks, such as Bents Lane Bredbury.
It's a point well made Dave and I know that you are speaking in the context of the current situation and I cannot disagree with your comment, it is, 'desperately needed.' I know that the transport argument has raged on this website over the years, I have followed it with interest and I have no wish to re-ignite it today, but in the long term if the answer is always to be another/bigger/wider road then the answer will always be yet again another/bigger/wider road.
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It's a point well made Dave and I know that you are speaking in the context of the current situation and I cannot disagree with your comment, it is, 'desperately needed.' I know that the transport argument has raged on this website over the years, I have followed it with interest and I have no wish to re-ignite it today, but in the long term if the answer is always to be another/bigger/wider road then the answer will always be yet again another/bigger/wider road.
If we just keep building more roads we are on a continuous cycle of congestion. However since most of this road is built its probably sensible to finish it off. I think that the current end point on the A6 near Hazel Grove is going to cause too many problems if left.
We need proper investment in the rail system, cycling etc.
Another related point, once you build a new road doesn't this then open up development opportunities along the route? The area around lower Bredbury and around the A6 junction in Havel Grove are mainly green fields. Will the new road lead to new development? I have no inside knowledge, is this a likely outcome?
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Personally,
I don't see more tarmac as being the answer to anything.
All that happens when we produce new roads is that after a period of time, they just add to the congestion. It's a cliché but more tarmac is just part of the problem and not part of the solution.
So what is the answer and the solution .
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If the population is allowed to keep increasing we are going to have to build more and more houses, roads, schools, hospitals, etc.
It's no use complaining about loss of green space. People need to live somewhere. One day there will be no green space left.
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If the population is allowed to keep increasing we are going to have to build more and more houses, roads, schools, hospitals, etc.
It's no use complaining about loss of green space. People need to live somewhere. One day there will be no green space left.
Yes there will! It will be to the rear of or around those who are able to finance or have the political power to fight and win the 'Not in My Back Yard' battles.
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since most of this road is built its probably sensible to finish it off. I think that the current end point on the A6 near Hazel Grove is going to cause too many problems if left.
We need proper investment in the rail system, cycling etc.
Words of wisdom from hatter.
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Personally the new SEMMS - A6MARR road is going to be an absolute godsend. But a whole load of extra congestion through Hawk Green / High Lane / 'Torky bends' can surely be anticipated.
The issue of congestion around our locality is not a new one, it's been around for decades, and it's markedly worse than in equivalent commuter areas. In my working life I have encountered many people who have lived in our area in the past, and the first thing they mention (without exception) is the traffic. Marple has a reputation far and wide for it. I can only think of areas around London, and Glossop, which are equally as bad.
It is quite normal to take 45 minutes to reach the M60 on a weekday morning, via any of the routes. This is totally unacceptable in terms of the effect on the economy and on air quality. Public transport is only a viable alternative for commuters who work in Manchester city centre, for whom it is great. Otherwise it simply takes too long. For those of us who have to endure wasting several hours a week stuck in Offerton or Bredbury crawling to the motorway a Bredbury -> airport link has been needed for ages. Despite the inevitable obfuscation, the solution in this instance is one of more tarmac.
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Personally the new SEMMS - A6MARR road is going to be an absolute godsend. But a whole load of extra congestion through Hawk Green / High Lane / 'Torky bends' can surely be anticipated.
The issue of congestion around our locality is not a new one, it's been around for decades, and it's markedly worse than in equivalent commuter areas. In my working life I have encountered many people who have lived in our area in the past, and the first thing they mention (without exception) is the traffic. Marple has a reputation far and wide for it. I can only think of areas around London, and Glossop, which are equally as bad.
It is quite normal to take 45 minutes to reach the M60 on a weekday morning, via any of the routes. This is totally unacceptable in terms of the effect on the economy and on air quality. Public transport is only a viable alternative for commuters who work in Manchester city centre, for whom it is great. Otherwise it simply takes too long. For those of us who have to endure wasting several hours a week stuck in Offerton or Bredbury crawling to the motorway a Bredbury -> airport link has been needed for ages. Despite the inevitable obfuscation, the solution in this instance is one of more tarmac.
Agreed. This has been needed for a long time and for most of the people who would benefit from the new road, public transport is not a viable option.
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Also, the point on 'more new tarmac'. Other than the M63 (now the M60) Cheadle -> Denton route which must be coming up to its 30th birthday soonish, maybe I'm wrong but I can't remember any new arterial roads being built in East Stockport. It's hardly as if our area has seen a continual road building / congestion cycle is it?
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On the basis of past experience surely the new road will just get bunged up and dysfunctional, like the M60 and M34? Particularly as there will be traffic-signal controlled junctions all the way along it from the M56 - an attempt by the planners to discourage traffic from diverting from the motorways. If another new road becomes necessary to relieve the relief road, where's that going to go? I urge everyone to take a look at the Goyt and Poise Brook Valleys to see what will be lost if the relief road is allowed to go all the way to the M60. There's a short walk through the valleys next Sunday, May 8 starting at 2.30 from the gates of Bredbury Hall, arranged by Goyt Valley SOS.
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If my memory serves me right, I think there was a junction to this new road proposed near to Fog Brook (?) in Offerton, am I correct?
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Also, the point on 'more new tarmac'. Other than the M63 (now the M60) Cheadle -> Denton route which must be coming up to its 30th birthday soonish, maybe I'm wrong but I can't remember any new arterial roads being built in East Stockport. It's hardly as if our area has seen a continual road building / congestion cycle is it?
Is that a source of regret to you Henry?
Do you like tarmac?
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A map published in the Messenger for October 6th 1989 shows the junction in Hazel Grove and the road going directly to the Brinnington roundabout. there is mention of a proposed Stepping Hill link.
The leaflet from late 2003 shows junctions on Offerton Road (Torkington Road), Bean Leech Road/Stepping Hill link, and Marple Road.
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On the basis of past experience surely the new road will just get bunged up and dysfunctional, like the M60 and M34? Particularly as there will be traffic-signal controlled junctions all the way along it from the M56 - an attempt by the planners to discourage traffic from diverting from the motorways. If another new road becomes necessary to relieve the relief road, where's that going to go? I urge everyone to take a look at the Goyt and Poise Brook Valleys to see what will be lost if the relief road is allowed to go all the way to the M60. There's a short walk through the valleys next Sunday, May 8 starting at 2.30 from the gates of Bredbury Hall, arranged by Goyt Valley SOS.
A lot of the work has allready been done in the goyt valley .its only a matter of time .and of coarse money .walks dont take priority over roads
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There is a study on going with a protected corridor... http://www.semmms.info/140683/Task4949_SEMMMS_routes_2
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The sooner it is built the better. The roads around here are getting atrocious even outside the normal commuting hours.
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The 'new road' will make little difference to the traffic congestion in Marple. it may in fact add to it. Don't get your hopes up. You will still be sat in your 45 minute traffic jam to the M60.
The answer is decidedly not more tarmac but less cars. If there is an answer to vehicular traffic and all its implications, then it is in public transport, our rush hour mentality, obsessions with our cars and our journeys to work. Also our civic leaders and transport planners continue to be reactive, visionless and have no spirit of adventure and consider traffic congestion to be a part of life today, as indeed it has come to be.
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The answer is decidedly not more tarmac but less cars. If there is an answer to vehicular traffic and all its implications, then it is in public transport,
I don't think it's either/or - we need both tarmac, sadly, and also better public transport. But train and bus services, however, good, will never completely replace cars.
You will still be sat in your 45 minute traffic jam to the M60.
I don't think so. For example, I go to Leeds every week or two. I go by train when I can, but sometimes I have to drive. It doesn't usually take 45 minutes to get through the Bredbury crawl to the M60, but it does take far too long.
When the relief road is built, I will be able to join it at Marple Road Offerton, and that will save a whole lot of time, even though the Dan Bank crawl will be as bad or worse than ever!
So I fear simone is right about this:
The 'new road' will make little difference to the traffic congestion in Marple. it may in fact add to it.
Yes, Dan Bank will probably get even worse, but on the other hand, there is likely to be less congestion in Bredbury, and on the A6 at Hazel Grove.
So we need the relief road, but it should go hand in hand with the proposed train or tram link to Stockport, which would help to reduce traffic on Dan Bank and through Offerton: http://www.marple-uk.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6623.0;attach=1151;image
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The 'new road' will make little difference to the traffic congestion in Marple. it may in fact add to it. Don't get your hopes up. You will still be sat in your 45 minute traffic jam to the M60.
The answer is decidedly not more tarmac but less cars. If there is an answer to vehicular traffic and all its implications, then it is in public transport, our rush hour mentality, obsessions with our cars and our journeys to work. Also our civic leaders and transport planners continue to be reactive, visionless and have no spirit of adventure and consider traffic congestion to be a part of life today, as indeed it has come to be.
I'd have to agree with this point above all others that have been made.
Certainly the traffic in and around Marple is atrocious, but a new road will only add to that traffic in the long run. Experience shows that eventually they just fill up.
I am a firm believer that rush hour traffic can - and should - be reduced by lateral problem solving, education and cultural change, and not by the building of more roads.
I used to work in Spinningfields, Manchester and commuted by train from Marple. I could easily have done that job from home, but had to take 2 hours out of my day to be present in an office. A waste of time, money, and energy. And significantly, someone else I know who lives a few streets away commutes to Spinningfields by car because he doesn't like the trains.
One obvious solution would be, where possible, office workers and clerical staff work from home. At the moment all they do is travel to an office and use a computer that is connected to a network - something they can easily do from home. No travel, no congestion, less money, everyone wins - employers, employees, environment etc. Obviously this isn't suitable for every single situation, but there are many many jobs that can be managed in this way.
Other ideas could be a hierarchy system whereby those who need car transport the most are given priority over more casual drivers in rush hour. How would this be managed? Not sure yet, but the idea is surely worthy of consideration.
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The 'new road' will make little difference to the traffic congestion in Marple. it may in fact add to it. Don't get your hopes up. You will still be sat in your 45 minute traffic jam to the M60.
The answer is decidedly not more tarmac but less cars. If there is an answer to vehicular traffic and all its implications, then it is in public transport, our rush hour mentality, obsessions with our cars and our journeys to work. Also our civic leaders and transport planners continue to be reactive, visionless and have no spirit of adventure and consider traffic congestion to be a part of life today, as indeed it has come to be.
The problem is that public transport will never be good enough to make it worth using for much. I was 36 before I had a car and went everywhere by public transport. It was only when I got a car (of necessity, as the rail service I relied on was withdrawn in 1994) that I realised just how much I'd been missing. I was amazed at how many places I could get to where no public transport could take me (or when it could, it took a ludicrous time to get there). Once you have a car, it's very hard to go back to public transport which even when well funded and extensive, is never anywhere near as good and will never go to anywhere near the majority of places I want to go at the times I want to get there.