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Archive => Archived Boards => Local Issues => Topic started by: Dave on April 08, 2016, 06:04:07 PM
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Members of this forum may be aware that our local LibDem councillors have been looking into the parking problems in Marple Bridge and at Marple Station.
Their findings have recently emerged, and can be read here: http://us13.campaign-archive1.com/?u=5d99d13f7cf2cbbe3a9db44ea&id=bb29a575be&e=4a6841c665
The report spares no detail - it's a very long read - but in summary, it makes four broad proposals:
1. Give permits to business owners and their staff (subject to some controls) for use anywhere except Town Street
2. Brabyns Brow to have more short stay (e.g. +15) and less long stay than currently, and two out of the 5 Disabled Bays to be delimited to short stay
3. Lobby Transport for Greater Manchester to add more spaces to the Purple Pakora Car Park (estimate 15 can be created)
4. Pay and Display on Longhurst Lane and Lower Fold to have a very high fee for longer term than 4 hours e.g. £10
Whilst we should acknowledge all the work that has gone in to this report, and be grateful that our councillors are showing an interest in this issue, I have to say I'm disappointed that the report has failed to address the main underlying cause of parking problems in that area, and that is overspill from the station. Every weekday, rail commuters who cannot find a space at the station or across the road behind the Purple Pakora, are clogging up the car park lower down Brabyns Brow, in Brabyns Park, on Winnington Road, and elsewhere. And the only proposal to address this issue is number 3, which suggests a paltry 15 more parking spaces behind the Purple Pakora. Fifteen, that's all! You could create fifteen more spaces within the existing car park by painting white lines on it, so that people don't park so far apart! And there's room for loads more spaces than that in the grassy area at the back of the existing car park.
Overall, I fear it's a timid report which lacks vision and imagination, and will do little if anything to find a long-term solution to the problem. Disappointing.
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I am against paying for parking on Lower Fold. I work at Ludworth Primary and sometimes can't get a space in the staff car park. If I am lucky I can get one in the two car parks across the road. A ten pound fee would put paid to that and I would have to find space on the side roads. Not exactly a neighbour friendly option.
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Members of this forum may be aware that our local LibDem councillors have been looking into the parking problems in Marple Bridge and at Marple Station.
Their findings have recently emerged, and can be read here: http://us13.campaign-archive1.com/?u=5d99d13f7cf2cbbe3a9db44ea&id=bb29a575be&e=4a6841c665
The report spares no detail - it's a very long read - but in summary, it makes four broad proposals:
1. Give permits to business owners and their staff (subject to some controls) for use anywhere except Town Street
2. Brabyns Brow to have more short stay (e.g. +15) and less long stay than currently, and two out of the 5 Disabled Bays to be delimited to short stay
3. Lobby Transport for Greater Manchester to add more spaces to the Purple Pakora Car Park (estimate 15 can be created)
4. Pay and Display on Longhurst Lane and Lower Fold to have a very high fee for longer term than 4 hours e.g. £10
Whilst we should acknowledge all the work that has gone in to this report, and be grateful that our councillors are showing an interest in this issue, I have to say I'm disappointed that the report has failed to address the main underlying cause of parking problems in that area, and that is overspill from the station. Every weekday, rail commuters who cannot find a space at the station or across the road behind the Purple Pakora, are clogging up the car park lower down Brabyns Brow, in Brabyns Park, on Winnington Road, and elsewhere. And the only proposal to address this issue is number 3, which suggests a paltry 15 more parking spaces behind the Purple Pakora. Fifteen, that's all! You could create fifteen more spaces within the existing car park by painting white lines on it, so that people don't park so far apart! And there's room for loads more spaces than that in the grassy area at the back of the existing car park.
Overall, I fear it's a timid report which lacks vision and imagination, and will do little if anything to find a long-term solution to the problem. Disappointing.
Interesting. Is there any option or discussion of trying to get more commuters to Rose Hill and spread them out more? (Better service). I use RH as it is quieter and better parking. I sometimes walk, both stations are almost a mile from where I live, but when I have childcare to sort have to drive. Could there be a way of encouraging more people to walk to the station ?
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Members of this forum may be aware that our local LibDem councillors have been looking into the parking problems in Marple Bridge and at Marple Station.
Their findings have recently emerged, and can be read here: http://us13.campaign-archive1.com/?u=5d99d13f7cf2cbbe3a9db44ea&id=bb29a575be&e=4a6841c665
The report spares no detail - it's a very long read - but in summary, it makes four broad proposals:
1. Give permits to business owners and their staff (subject to some controls) for use anywhere except Town Street
2. Brabyns Brow to have more short stay (e.g. +15) and less long stay than currently, and two out of the 5 Disabled Bays to be delimited to short stay
3. Lobby Transport for Greater Manchester to add more spaces to the Purple Pakora Car Park (estimate 15 can be created)
4. Pay and Display on Longhurst Lane and Lower Fold to have a very high fee for longer term than 4 hours e.g. £10
Whilst we should acknowledge all the work that has gone in to this report, and be grateful that our councillors are showing an interest in this issue, I have to say I'm disappointed that the report has failed to address the main underlying cause of parking problems in that area, and that is overspill from the station. Every weekday, rail commuters who cannot find a space at the station or across the road behind the Purple Pakora, are clogging up the car park lower down Brabyns Brow, in Brabyns Park, on Winnington Road, and elsewhere. And the only proposal to address this issue is number 3, which suggests a paltry 15 more parking spaces behind the Purple Pakora. Fifteen, that's all! You could create fifteen more spaces within the existing car park by painting white lines on it, so that people don't park so far apart! And there's room for loads more spaces than that in the grassy area at the back of the existing car park.
Overall, I fear it's a timid report which lacks vision and imagination, and will do little if anything to find a long-term solution to the problem. Disappointing.
So what is your long term solution to the problem Dave.
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The report spares no detail - it's a very long read - but in summary, it makes four broad proposals:
1. Give permits to business owners and their staff (subject to some controls) for use anywhere except Town Street
2. Brabyns Brow to have more short stay (e.g. +15) and less long stay than currently, and two out of the 5 Disabled Bays to be delimited to short stay
3. Lobby Transport for Greater Manchester to add more spaces to the Purple Pakora Car Park (estimate 15 can be created)
4. Pay and Display on Longhurst Lane and Lower Fold to have a very high fee for longer term than 4 hours e.g. £10
A factor not mentioned in this brief summary (though mentioned frequently in the report) is the large number of cars belonging to drivers from Derbyshire who park at Marple to take advantage of the considerably cheaper train fares within Greater Manchester. The problem will become considerably worse when the Conservatives attempt to destroy public transport in Derbyshire by withdrawing public transport subsidies later this year (and with local elections coming up in Marple remember that the Conservatives would do just the same in Stockport if they were to gain a majority: don't believe a word about Conservative support for the 394 - when I called at William Wragg's office a few weeks ago I had to explain to the staff that the 394 was a bus service to Stepping Hill and Glossop which passed the MP's surgery door but they did not have the slightest knowledge of its existence so hardly cared about its continuation and the only place that they could manage to find a photograph of the bus for the Conservative website was from the site of the Labour Councillor for Gamesley, it beggars belief that the staff were unaware that there is a timetable on the bus shelter next door to or opposite to William Wragg's office in Marple which would have told them that a photograph of the bus in Marple was available at 01 minute past or 08 minutes past the hour). One solution could be £10 pay and display for four hours on the station car parks/Longhurst Lane/Lower Fold but permits enabling free parking for Greater Manchester residents. My feeling is that roadside parking on Lower Fold and Longhurst Lane from Clement Road to Marple Bridge should be residents only if there is not currently a parking prohibition.
I don't have a great deal of sympathy for any car owner (other than someone with limited mobility or a disability) who lives within a mile of the station: they can walk or get a 383/384, 375 or 394 (still there just about). One thing everyone seems to be forgetting is that the traffic chaos is one of the very things deterring the construction of a lot more residential properties on the green spaces at the rear of Clement Road or higher up Longhurst Lane. Traffic problems are a major factor prohibiting applications for planning permission for construction of more houses on the green spaces in Mellor. Solve the traffic problems in Marple Bridge in 2016 more planning applications will be approved and by 2020 the problem will have re-appeared in the form of even more cars. Ironically the traffic problems are preventing the population of Marple from exploding. There is not a person in Stockport who would not want to live here: if commuting by car becomes easier this would be a death warrant for the area so strange as it may seem, the congestion is protecting the value of your house.
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Why can't the stops employ people that live close enough not to drive, hence fee up parking spaces of their customers?
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A factor not mentioned in this brief summary (though mentioned frequently in the report) is the large number of cars belonging to drivers from Derbyshire who park at Marple to take advantage of the considerably cheaper train fares within Greater Manchester. The problem will become considerably worse when the Conservatives attempt to destroy public transport in Derbyshire by withdrawing public transport subsidies later this year (and with local elections coming up in Marple remember that the Conservatives would do just the same in Stockport if they were to gain a majority: don't believe a word about Conservative support for the 394 - when I called at William Wragg's office a few weeks ago I had to explain to the staff that the 394 was a bus service to Stepping Hill and Glossop which passed the MP's surgery door but they did not have the slightest knowledge of its existence so hardly cared about its continuation and the only place that they could manage to find a photograph of the bus for the Conservative website was from the site of the Labour Councillor for Gamesley, it beggars belief that the staff were unaware that there is a timetable on the bus shelter next door to or opposite to William Wragg's office in Marple which would have told them that a photograph of the bus in Marple was available at 01 minute past or 08 minutes past the hour). One solution could be £10 pay and display for four hours on the station car parks/Longhurst Lane/Lower Fold but permits enabling free parking for Greater Manchester residents. My feeling is that roadside parking on Lower Fold and Longhurst Lane from Clement Road to Marple Bridge should be residents only if there is not currently a parking prohibition.
I don't have a great deal of sympathy for any car owner (other than someone with limited mobility or a disability) who lives within a mile of the station: they can walk or get a 383/384, 375 or 394 (still there just about). One thing everyone seems to be forgetting is that the traffic chaos is one of the very things deterring the construction of a lot more residential properties on the green spaces at the rear of Clement Road or higher up Longhurst Lane. Traffic problems are a major factor prohibiting applications for planning permission for construction of more houses on the green spaces in Mellor. Solve the traffic problems in Marple Bridge in 2016 more planning applications will be approved and by 2020 the problem will have re-appeared in the form of even more cars. Ironically the traffic problems are preventing the population of Marple from exploding. There is not a person in Stockport who would not want to live here: if commuting by car becomes easier this would be a death warrant for the area so strange as it may seem, the congestion is protecting the value of your house.
Good points re the Conservatives and 394. Tom Dowse (Marple candidate) was claiming credit for Wragg for saving 394 on the leaflet put through my door the other day.
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So what is your long term solution to the problem Dave.
A proper park-and-ride car park, similar to what they have at Hazel Grove. There is plenty of space at the back of the Purple Pakora.
All the stuff about 'people should walk to the station' and 'people should be prevented from coming across the Derbyshire boundary' (how?), is just whistling in the dark. It's a free country, thank goodness! People who live a mile or more from the station (and most of us do) will drive. If we can't park, we'll drive into Manchester and make the roads even more congested and cause even more environmental damage than we do already.
As for this: I don't have a great deal of sympathy for any car owner (other than someone with limited mobility or a disability) who lives within a mile of the station: they can walk or get a 383/384, 375 or 394
.... yes, that's a reasonable point for anyone liveng on or near the 383/384 route, because it's a frequent and fairly reliable service. But as far as the 375 or 394 are concerned - forget it. Those buses are so infrequent and also unreliable in timekeeping, that trying to get a train/bus connection with either of those bus routes is doomed to fail - I know, I've tried often enough!
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There is a very simple solution to the parking problems at the station.
Just charge for parking. Say £5, or even £10, for the day, with no charge for disabled users. People would soon rediscover that their legs do work, even in the rain. Anyone needing to carry a heavy bag could get a lift or a taxi, it would be cheaper than parking.
Why should anyone think they can have exclusive use of about 6 sq metres of land for the day at no charge?
This is how it works at all the stations I have used in the south east, where the majority of people either walk or get a lift to the station.
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There is a very simple solution to the parking problems at the station.
Just charge for parking. Say £5, or even £10, for the day, with no charge for disabled users. People would soon rediscover that their legs do work, even in the rain. Anyone needing to carry a heavy bag could get a lift or a taxi, it would be cheaper than parking.
Why should anyone think they can have exclusive use of about 6 sq metres of land for the day at no charge?
This is how it works at all the stations I have used in the south east, where the majority of people either walk or get a lift to the station.
The answer is to look at Dale road this week which is full of cars. The stations in the South East will all be surrounded by double yellow lines for some significant distance beyond the station or have restrictions which make it impossible to park all day. Unless this is done here you will simply shift the problem a couple of hundred yards
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There is a very simple solution to the parking problems at the station.
Just charge for parking. Say £5, or even £10, for the day, with no charge for disabled users. People would soon rediscover that their legs do work, even in the rain.
Maybe some of them will, but many others will rediscover that they can drive into Manchester more cheaply, and will do exactly that, thereby adding to our already chronic traffic congestion. The whole point of park-and-ride is to get traffic off the roads and reduce carbon emissions. if you charge for parking you simply introduce a disincentive to travel by train.
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Maybe some of them will, but many others will rediscover that they can drive into Manchester more cheaply, and will do exactly that, thereby adding to our already chronic traffic congestion. The whole point of park-and-ride is to get traffic off the roads and reduce carbon emissions. if you charge for parking you simply introduce a disincentive to travel by train.
Whenever you take a car off your property you should be prepared to pay to park it somewhere.
When I worked in the centre of Manchester, many years ago, it used to take me up to an hour to drive in, the same to return, and cost me £10 a day to park. I often needed my car because I had to visit customers. On the days that I didn't need the car, I would get the train. Nobody in their right mind would attempt to drive in unless they had to.
The incentive to travel by train is the reduced time, stress and cost.
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It doesn't effect me personally as currently and fortunately I am able to walk from and to either of Marple's two stations. It is a 'free country' as Dave says and people can choose whatever method there is to convey themselves to the station/s. I agree with this but if others have taken all the parking spaces when you get there, then they are free to do that as well.
The only other point I would make is that last year early in the morning I drove over from New Mills to Marple. I was in the middle of a snake of about 15 cars and when I arrived at Marple Bridge almost all of them turned into Brabyns car park. I didn't stop to look but I think many of them were catching the train. Now that car park is managed by Stockport MBC. New Mills isn't in the borough, it isn't even in the same county. Residents of New Mills Make make no contribution to that car park at all. If the same situation existed in a Stockport street the Council would devise a resident's permit scheme. So why can't we have a similar scheme for the car park where for a nominal annual charge (used to administer the scheme) you get a car park permit providing you can demonstrate that you either live in Marple or work in Marple Bridge? If you haven't got a permit in your window - you have to pay to park - or you get the attention of the traffic warden.
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Nobody in their right mind would attempt to drive in unless they had to.
Amazingly, there are a lot of people who are not in their right mind and who choose to commute in to Manchester by car! It's a worldwide phenomenon, and cities everywhere are trying to tackle it by introducing park and ride schemes. We just need to get our act together.
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My feeling is that roadside parking on Lower Fold and Longhurst Lane from Clement Road to Marple Bridge should be residents only if there is not currently a parking prohibition.
Why should it. I pay road tax every year to use the roads. Why should I not be allowed to park between Clement Road and Marple Bridge. If people choose to buy houses with no off-road parking, why should they be provided with a free parking space. The prices of every house between Clement Road and Marple Bridge would have bought a house elsewhere with off-road parking. They have chosen to buy without off-road parking.
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There is no cheap drive in and out of Manchester. Apart from the time it takes which is easily an hour both ways on a good day and if you are lucky. Then there is fuel, wear and tear on your car and finally some of the highest parking charges in the country.
As Harry says the only people that drive into Manchester are those with no alternative.
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As Harry says the only people that drive into Manchester are those with no alternative.
Sorry Simone, but that simply isn't true. It's amazing the number of people who are hooked on their cars and will never think of using public transport.
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Sorry Simone, but that simply isn't true. It's amazing the number of people who are hooked on their cars and will never think of using public transport.
Dave, you are of course right, there are lots of people who won't get out of their cars. I have a neighbour and despite the fact she rarely leaves Marple, she rides around it all day in her car. She takes her husband for the train, her kids to school, then she goes for the newspapers, then for the shopping and so on. She even takes the dog to the park in her car. Whatever the errand, whatever the weather she goes in her car.
On the few occasions she goes into Manchester she goes on the train.
Even carholics don't drive into Manchester, if there is n alternative.
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Sorry Simone, but that simply isn't true. It's amazing the number of people who are hooked on their cars and will never think of using public transport.
True. I am in a minority using the train in my workplace. Many of us come from areas around Marple. However, trains are not for the faint hearted. Especially as we need to get two trains and need both to be on time. It isn't cheap at £6.40 a day and having to stand or be crammed in. You can see why many would rather sit comfortably in their cars.
Often on the way back, trains have been cancelled, too crowded we can't get on etc. When you have to be back for a certain time to pick kids up, you need reliable transport. Leaving earlier and walking isn't an option when childcare only opens at 7.30an and you need 2 trains to be there for 9. I have also heard more than one person say they are worried re terrorists attacks!
I can see why people drive. If trains were better and cheaper I think more people would use them.
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Why should it. I pay road tax every year to use the roads.
No you don't, no such thing as road tax.
That said, anyone who pays Council tax contributes to the upkeep of the local roads, so you have got a point there :-)
Why should I not be allowed to park between Clement Road and Marple Bridge. If people choose to buy houses with no off-road parking, why should they be provided with a free parking space. The prices of every house between Clement Road and Marple Bridge would have bought a house elsewhere with off-road parking. They have chosen to buy without off-road parking.
It's a tricky one, I can see both sides. Making that area residents only parking would provide wider traffic/congestion benefits than merely just guaranteeing local residents a space outside their house to park.
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The report spares no detail - it's a very long read - but in summary, it makes four broad proposals:
1. Give permits to business owners and their staff (subject to some controls) for use anywhere except Town Street
2. Brabyns Brow to have more short stay (e.g. +15) and less long stay than currently, and two out of the 5 Disabled Bays to be delimited to short stay
3. Lobby Transport for Greater Manchester to add more spaces to the Purple Pakora Car Park (estimate 15 can be created)
4. Pay and Display on Longhurst Lane and Lower Fold to have a very high fee for longer term than 4 hours e.g. £10
which suggests a paltry 15 more parking spaces behind the Purple Pakora. Fifteen, that's all! You could create fifteen more spaces within the existing car park by painting white lines on it, so that people don't park so far apart! And there's room for loads more spaces than that in the grassy area at the back of the existing car park.
The 4 broad proposals are similar to my own thoughts, apart from the extra 15 spaces. Like @Dave my view is that many more are possible. I would estimate around 60-70, so a substantial increase which would alleviate many of the problems. Hopefully this is something that could be progressed.
Interesting. Is there any option or discussion of trying to get more commuters to Rose Hill and spread them out more? (Better service). I use RH as it is quieter and better parking. I sometimes walk, both stations are almost a mile from where I live, but when I have childcare to sort have to drive. Could there be a way of encouraging more people to walk to the station ?
I think that a better Rose Hill service would definitely help, and longer term tram/train to Rose Hill would improve things further.
A factor not mentioned in this brief summary (though mentioned frequently in the report) is the large number of cars belonging to drivers from Derbyshire who park at Marple to take advantage of the considerably cheaper train fares within Greater Manchester. One solution could be £10 pay and display for four hours on the station car parks/Longhurst Lane/Lower Fold but permits enabling free parking for Greater Manchester residents. My feeling is that roadside parking on Lower Fold and Longhurst Lane from Clement Road to Marple Bridge should be residents only if there is not currently a parking prohibition.
Some form of pay and display with free residents parking may be an option, though costs of running this would have to be covered. The down side may be displacing "outsiders" cars onto residential streets which is already a problem.
don't believe a word about Conservative support for the 394 -
There was considerable Conservative support for this, this involved lots of lobbying of Derbyshire and Stockport council and TFGM, a petition, working in liaison with Andrew Bingham MP and office. Due to our close involvement you will recall I was able to inform you that despite high hopes, contract was not signed and further issues needed sorting here http://www.marple-uk.com/smf/index.php?topic=6726.msg40820#msg40820
A proper park-and-ride car park, similar to what they have at Hazel Grove. There is plenty of space at the back of the Purple Pakora.
All the stuff about 'people should walk to the station' and 'people should be prevented from coming across the Derbyshire boundary' (how?), is just whistling in the dark. It's a free country, thank goodness! People who live a mile or more from the station (and most of us do) will drive. If we can't park, we'll drive into Manchester and make the roads even more congested and cause even more environmental damage than we do already.
I find myself agreeing with you again @Dave . If at all possible substantial expansion of this parking is I feel the best way forward, in conjunction with the other changes mentioned.
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I really can't see how displacing outsiders from those car parks is going to cause wider traffic problems. You are still going to get the same amount of overall traffic but priority parking would be given to Marple residents and Marple workers.
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JMC, £6.40 for travelling in and out of Manchester is pretty good. You wouldn't get anywhere near that in a car.
It would probably cost you almost that in petrol alone.
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Why should it. I pay road tax every year to use the...........
No you don't. ...nobody pays road fund tax, it was abolished in 1937
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The 4 broad proposals are similar to my own thoughts, apart from the extra 15 spaces. Like @Dave my view is that many more are possible. I would estimate around 60-70, so a substantial increase which would alleviate many of the problems. Hopefully this is something that could be progressed.
OK, that's one vote in the bag, John. ;)
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I really can't see how displacing outsiders from those car parks is going to cause wider traffic problems. You are still going to get the same amount of overall traffic but priority parking would be given to Marple residents and Marple workers.
True up to a point. However if parking easier, may get more local people parking rather than walking etc.
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OK, that's one vote in the bag, John. ;)
;)
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The risk of not getting a parking space does lead people to drive into Manchester.
My wife is disabled, but even with a blue badge often can’t get a space at a station mid morning, or mid day to go into Manchester for a meeting that takes a few hours. She has been late to meetings in the past due to driving to the station, then not being able to part close enough, so having to then drive to the meeting. Therefore these days, she will often drive directly to the meeting. (In winter there is also the risk that some of the path from her car door to the train door may not have been gritted and clear of snow/ice, if the weather gets worse before she returns.)
Once the time taken to get from the station in Manchester to the meeting is taken into account driving directly from her office is often as quick as driving to a station, then taking the train. Mostly due to her meetings not starting at 9am.
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True up to a point. However if parking easier, may get more local people parking rather than walking etc.
It's possible, but surely John even that is better than outsiders taking up parking spaces. At least those spaces are being taken up by locals. The locals should have the choice of whether they walk or dive to the station, they shouldn't be forced to walk because New
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...CTND...Millsers have taken their parking spaces.
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I live (Google maps) 1.5 miles by road or 1.3 miles on foot from Marple station, I wouldn't dream of parking down there when I can walk it in under half an hour.
There must be a lot of people with less mobility, don't want the exercise, or who live further away eg Turf Lea, Windlehurst, Far end of Mellor, Chisworth, etc. People living on Strines new estate where trains stop less frequent. Jobs in Marple bridge; shops, cafe's & pubs could be people from outside the area. Teachers & workers at Ludworth school may come in from outside, very little parking at the school. Contractors working on homes & business's need to park locally.
If local people unnecessarily take up the spaces, where will all these people park? We have to be more considerate to people who have little or no alternative. Or provide a lot more parking.
It might help if children walked to school like most of us oldies would have done. Keep childhood obesity down.
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No you don't. ...nobody pays road fund tax, it was abolished in 1937
Well I pay something every year, whatever it is called now, and that is what I meant.
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Point well made Russ, but do you walk it there and back everyday in all weathers and are you racing the clock because of a busy schedule when you do it.
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I think that a better Rose Hill service would definitely help, and longer term tram/train to Rose Hill would improve things further.
What you are really saying here is that Marple will be left with a much slower and probably reduced service via Hyde as a result of the Rose Hill tram trains. People won't want to park at Marple in such great numbers and the problem will move up to Rose Hill.
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Point well made Russ, but do you walk it there and back everyday in all weathers and are you racing the clock because of a busy schedule when you do it.
I did when working in Manchester. Had to manage time according to workload, early to bed etc.
No shame in wearing w'proofs or using a brolly.
I have travelled by car to work over the Pennines when I have had to leave the car & walk, the conditions were that bad. Never seen any weather that would stop me walking to Marple station. Driving yes, over the years I've seen cars stuck for days in snow around Marple. Never bad enough to stop me walking.
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I did when working in Manchester. Had to manage time according to workload, early to bed etc.
No shame in wearing w'proofs or using a brolly.
I have travelled by car to work over the Pennines when I have had to leave the car & walk, the conditions were that bad. Never seen any weather that would stop me walking to Marple station. Driving yes, over the years I've seen cars stuck for days in snow around Marple. Never bad enough to stop me walking.
Tremendous post Russ, Love it. 'No shame in wearing w'proofs or using a brolly.' Absolutely not, poetic prose . Cheered me up no end on a Monday night with my bottle of Gewurtztraminer,
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What you are really saying here is that Marple will be left with a much slower and probably reduced service via Hyde as a result of the Rose Hill tram trains. People won't want to park at Marple in such great numbers and the problem will move up to Rose Hill.
No I am not saying that that the Marple service would be made slower or reduced. Not sure why that should be the case.
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No I am not saying that that the Marple service would be made slower or reduced. Not sure why that should be the case.
If Rose Hill via Bredbury goes to tram trains that leaves Marple with old diesel trains going via Hyde which is 13 miles as opposed to 9 and 34 minutes as opposed to 24. You have absolutely no plans to improve services from Marple despite your frequent statements. It is also unlikely that GM transport will support 4 peak time trains per hour from Marple to run in competition to their favoured Rose Hill trams.
Without going over old ground I am not sure that Rose Hill tram trains should be classed as an improvement with street running replacing a dedicated line and only 60 seats in a tram as opposed to 150 in a train.
Like I say this will transfer the parking issue up the hill.
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Well I pay something every year, whatever it is called now, and that is what I meant.
Road fund tax was a tax charged on vehicles and was used for the maintenance of roads. This was abolished in 1937 and you now pay vehicle exceise duty. This goes into general taxation and has nothing whatsoever to do with the upkeep of roads or what many drivers see as their right to claim some sort of priority over other road users.
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If Rose Hill via Bredbury goes to tram trains that leaves Marple with old diesel trains
No. The 'old diesel trains' will have been replaced some years before tram-train comes along (if it ever does!).
It is also unlikely that GM transport will support 4 peak time trains per hour from Marple to run in competition to their favoured Rose Hill trams.
Why should there be more than the present two trains per hour from Marple? Given the extra capacity of the tram-trains running from Rose Hill and Romiley, that should be sufficient.
I am not sure that Rose Hill tram trains should be classed as an improvement with street running replacing a dedicated line and only 60 seats in a tram as opposed to 150 in a train.
Two Class 142 DMUs have 120 seats, not 150. There are two trains per hour, making a total of 240 seats per hour. Trams have 60 seats plus much more standing room. There will be five tram-trains per hour, making a total of 300 seats per hour. That is greater capacity, and a great improvement on the present service.
Like I say this will transfer the parking issue up the hill.
There can never be much more parking space at Rose Hill. And that end of Marple is already a peak-time traffic jam. A lot of people will continue to use Marple, many of them transferring at Romiley to a tram-train at the same platform.
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I did when working in Manchester. Had to manage time according to workload, early to bed etc.
No shame in wearing w'proofs or using a brolly.
I have travelled by car to work over the Pennines when I have had to leave the car & walk, the conditions were that bad. Never seen any weather that would stop me walking to Marple station. Driving yes, over the years I've seen cars stuck for days in snow around Marple. Never bad enough to stop me walking.
Good man @Russ There is no such thing as bad weather, just the wrong clothes and the wrong shoes.
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I think that the parking issues around Rose Hill last week,when Marple was operating on replacement buses, pretty much demonstrated how unsuitable Rose Hill station is for expansion.
The cars parked on Dale Road and the approach to the station made both these roads one way at times. A downright nuisance when trying to get onto or off Stockport Road.
Not sure where the cars are going with the Pakora car park still out of action. I can't honestly say I've noticed any problems around Marple station but maybe the school holidays are helping reduce the demand this week.
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They are all on Winnington and Bradshaw Roads!
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I think that the parking issues around Rose Hill last week,when Marple was operating on replacement buses, pretty much demonstrated how unsuitable Rose Hill station is for expansion.
Simple solution. Take the area on Railway Road that is currently allotments, and turn it into a car park.
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Simple solution. Take the area on Railway Road that is currently allotments, and turn it into a car park.
:o Or leave them as allotments so we retain some green space! For the National Route 55 of the National Cycle , Josh Robinson sold a strip of their land to widen a stretch of pavement, (why the council didn't buy the full length of land and widen it all only the council will know I guess!). Why not buy Josh Robinson's land outright and use that for a car park. It'd look better having a car park as part of the existing station car park rather than the JCB park and gravel storage facility that it is now.
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Why not buy Josh Robinson's land outright and use that for a car park. It'd look better having a car park as part of the existing station car park rather than the JCB park and gravel storage facility that it is now.
Interestingly Josh Robinson's site is highlighted as "Future housing land supply 2024 - 2035" on the Great Manchester Spatial Framework.
http://mappinggm.org.uk/call-for-sites/development-sites.htm
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Interestingly Josh Robinson's site is highlighted as "Future housing land supply 2024 - 2035" on the Great Manchester Spatial Framework.
http://mappinggm.org.uk/call-for-sites/development-sites.htm
and does that include the allotments as well?
Great! build more houses in Marple and add to the queue of traffic on Stockport Road in the mornings. I don't suppose we'd get the second part of the bypass from Hazel Grove through to the motorway before the houses get built?
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Interestingly Josh Robinson's site is highlighted as "Future housing land supply 2024 - 2035" on the Great Manchester Spatial Framework.
http://mappinggm.org.uk/call-for-sites/development-sites.htm
Wow! What a really interesting site. I've never seen that before. It's interesting that it shows the area on Church STreet down to Lockside as being in the 2019-2024 development area. Some of that land is already used for New Horizons and surely the old buildings down near the Lockside end are listed and of historical interest?
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What also may be interesting and isn't surprising to me, is that the whole of the Marple Dale care home site is identified, including the one remaining building that Barchester are saying they are committed to retaining. Even if they do this there is a lot of land around it. There must be questions over the site's future with significant implications for residential care in the Marple area
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Why not buy Josh Robinson's land outright and use that for a car park. It'd look better having a car park as part of the existing station car park
Perhaps because Josh Robinson's land is supporting a Marple business, providing jobs and contributing to the economy of Marple and Stockport whereas the economy of Marple and Stockport are subsidising the allotments providing generally many already fairly wealthy people their own opportunity to follow 'The Goode Life' lifestyle.
This site should not be highlighted as 'Future housing supply land for 2024-2035', if it is used for anything it should be for parking space for commuters. It is hardly the most desirable site for housing with a busy main road on one side, a railway station and existing parking on another and finally a council tip and building supplies business to the rear.
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Perhaps because Josh Robinson's land is supporting a Marple business, providing jobs and contributing to the economy of Marple and Stockport whereas the economy of Marple and Stockport are subsidising the allotments providing generally many already fairly wealthy people their own opportunity to follow 'The Goode Life' lifestyle.
This site should not be highlighted as 'Future housing supply land for 2024-2035', if it is used for anything it should be for parking space for commuters. It is hardly the most desirable site for housing with a busy main road on one side, a railway station and existing parking on another and finally a council tip and building supplies business to the rear.
" The economy of Marple and Stockport are subsidising the allotments providing generally many already fairly wealthy people their own opportunity to follow 'The Goode Life' lifestyle"
...and who do you think pays the council tax and income tax that "subsidises" allotments? People who might actually live near this site, next to that busy main road, the council tip, the Railway Station (which I regularly use I might add), the building supplier (which I also regularly use). Suffice to say, those taxes also subsidise MiddleWood Way, which I'm sure as a rambler you must regularly use?
Incidentally, I didn't suggest Josh Robinson ceases to trade, nor do I have an allotment.
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Road fund tax was a tax charged on vehicles and was used for the maintenance of roads. This was abolished in 1937 and you now pay vehicle exceise duty. This goes into general taxation and has nothing whatsoever to do with the upkeep of roads or what many drivers see as their right to claim some sort of priority over other road users.
I still do not see why some people should be given free parking spaces if they have chosen to purchase properties that do not have off road parking. I have the same right to use the parking spaces available between Clement Road and Marple Bridge as anyone else.
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I have the same right to use the parking spaces available between Clement Road and Marple Bridge as anyone else.
One of the issues is that many spaces are taken up by those who do have off road parking but have had problems getting in and out of their drives because
- they get blocked in by others
- they can't see past the Chelsea tractors to get in and out safely unless there is someone there to help them
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The most useful site for Rose Hill expansion would surely be Pearson Fuels, allowing that whole area (and the rather dodgy-looking Middlewood Way entrance) to be opened out, including the turning circle outside the car park which is currently a huge waste of space. Then building a parking deck similar to Hazel Grove over that entire length including the current car park would probably quadruple parking at little cost.
Finally, add a decent evening train service as good as Marple gets and suddenly as people switch you'll solve much of the Marple parking problem too.
It would be interesting to survey Marple station users and ask "If it received the same number of trains and had more parking, would you actually favour Rose Hill over Marple?" The answer might be surprising...
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That's a really good point from rsh. Without actual statistics it's hard to be sure, but there must surely be quite a lot more residents within a short walk (say half a mile) of Rose Hill than there are the same distance from Marple. And as rsh says, with a proper evening (and Sunday) service, and a bigger car park, Rose Hill could also take a lot of pressure off car parking at Marple.
Maybe there was a time, long ago, when coal depots were sited next to stations, but those days have long gone, and Pearsons could operate just as well anywhere in the area. If SMBC and TfGM could get together and look for another site, and then help Pearsons to vacate their present site and move, that could be a big step forward.
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The most useful site for Rose Hill expansion would surely be Pearson Fuels, allowing that whole area (and the rather dodgy-looking Middlewood Way entrance) to be opened out, including the turning circle outside the car park which is currently a huge waste of space. Then building a parking deck similar to Hazel Grove over that entire length including the current car park would probably quadruple parking at little cost.
Finally, add a decent evening train service as good as Marple gets and suddenly as people switch you'll solve much of the Marple parking problem too.
It would be interesting to survey Marple station users and ask "If it received the same number of trains and had more parking, would you actually favour Rose Hill over Marple?" The answer might be surprising...
No it won't work as the trains through Hyde take 10 minutes longer, people will still want to use Marple. If you mixed up the Bredbury and Hyde trains from Marple and Rose Hill it might have more effect.
We need a metro timetable introducing across all GM lines, similar to the proposals in London and Leeds where all stations have a 15 minute frequency.
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Simple solution. Take the area on Railway Road that is currently allotments, and turn it into a car park.
Can't be done - at least not without a change in the law and I doubt Parliament would be prepared to waste time on repealing a law which covers the whole of the country just to provide parking for a few railway users in Marple.
Under the Small Holdings and Allotments Act 1908 the council have a "statutory obligation/duty" (and therefore mandatory) to provide land to be used as allotments where six or more council tax payers make a request for allotments and to acquire land for that purpose where it doesn't already exist. Where would SMBC find a suitable area in Marple to relocate the allotments to? Would they try to relocate the Marple allotments to the other end of the Stockport area?
Mind you, there were allotments on what is now the Seven Stiles housing estate when I was a girl. Where did they go?
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Mind you, there were allotments on what is now the Seven Stiles housing estate when I was a girl. Where did they go?
I don't recall allotments being on the Seven Stiles site. It was always a field as I recall. You can use this website to examine an aerial view (1970s) taken before the houses were built -
http://maps.cheshire.gov.uk/tithemaps/Default.aspx (http://maps.cheshire.gov.uk/tithemaps/Default.aspx)
enter postcode: SK6 6LT