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Archive => Archived Boards => Local Elections and Council Matters => Topic started by: Hoffnung on November 24, 2015, 12:07:08 PM

Title: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on November 24, 2015, 12:07:08 PM
Hello,

Thank you,

To all whom supported my introduction to this website.

Our public realm is deteriorating for sure and I don't think that it has much to do with money. As Dave says, it isn't asking much to keep our parks in order.

There are numerous examples of this disorder. Here's one, I've just walked up from Marple Bridge to Marple. It was raining heavily, water was cascading down the road and I got drenched by the splash back from the passing traffic, it was unavoidable. Every other gully in the road was blocked. That's not lack of money, that's just lack of interest.

The political representation of Marple within the council is the worst that it has been.

We've got two Councillors who are fully occupied and distracted being Executive Members and to make it even worse, both of them are standing down before the next election. We've got another two who are brand new, one of these rookies has a full time job. We've got another who also has a full time job and apparently we've got one who has been in Oldham all week, helping his party with the forthcoming by-election.

As well as this, there is also the party politicking, which we are now getting, which only serves to be divisive. Don't take my word for this watch Cllrs Candler and Blair's clash at the last Council Meeting. Next year we will have even two more brand new Councillors and if the prospective Lib Dem candidates are successful then both these Councillors will have full time jobs. 

It is all a bit of a mess. What we need is some on the ground undistracted, focussed,  representation by committed Councillors who will speak up for and get things done in Marple.     

Austerity is going to be around for a while. We can't just blame the deterioration of our Public Realm on that for the next ten years. 


A new thread split from "Council Plans to remove "full time" staffing of Memorial Park". Admin.     
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: amazon on November 24, 2015, 02:20:13 PM
Hello,

Thank you,

To all whom supported my introduction to this website.

Our public realm is deteriorating for sure and I don't think that it has much to do with money. As Dave says, it isn't asking much to keep our parks in order.

There are numerous examples of this disorder. Here's one, I've just walked up from Marple Bridge to Marple. It was raining heavily, water was cascading down the road and I got drenched by the splash back from the passing traffic, it was unavoidable. Every other gully in the road was blocked. That's not lack of money, that's just lack of interest.

The political representation of Marple within the council is the worst that it has been.

We've got two Councillors who are fully occupied and distracted being Executive Members and to make it even worse, both of them are standing down before the next election. We've got another two who are brand new, one of these rookies has a full time job. We've got another who also has a full time job and apparently we've got one who has been in Oldham all week, helping his party with the forthcoming by-election.

As well as this, there is also the party politicking, which we are now getting, which only serves to be divisive. Don't take my word for this watch Cllrs Candler and Blair's clash at the last Council Meeting. Next year we will have even two more brand new Councillors and if the prospective Lib Dem candidates are successful then both these Councillors will have full time jobs. 

It is all a bit of a mess. What we need is some on the ground undistracted, focussed,  representation by committed Councillors who will speak up for and get things done in Marple.     

Austerity is going to be around for a while. We can't just blame the deterioration of our Public Realm on that for the next ten years. 


A new thread split from "Council Plans to remove "full time" staffing of Memorial Park". Admin.     
Why dont you put up at the next election .and get things moving .
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: alstan on November 24, 2015, 06:00:49 PM
If it takes so little to keep our parks in order then go and do it, others do.

Most drain blockage would have occurred over the past 3/4 weeks. I wonder how many drains there are in Stockport? 1000, 5000? I have no idea but I don't suppose the teams responsible for clearance head straight to Brabyn's Brow as the top priority in the Metropolitan Borough

Reference was made to The "clash" between Councillor's Blair and Candler at the last council meeting which was on 21st October. If that refers to their Q and A session under item 4b then it was incredibly bland, so bland that I wonder if there was another exchange which I have missed. In fact the whole meeting seemed to be conducted in quite a jolly atmosphere.

In the 1970s I was a college governor appointed to represent the interests of industry and commerce which, between them, accounted for 80% of the students and paid a similar proportion of the fees. The behaviour of the political appointees was pitiful, nothing but continuous bickering.

As far as councillors in full time employment are concerned, they are there because they got more votes than other candidates. Perhaps we should hand elections over to U3A whose members do not, by definition, have full time employment

Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 24, 2015, 06:45:46 PM
You sound like an apologist for the council Franz.

I think Hoffnung makes some good points. The reference that you make to the drain blockage in para 2 of your apology on the Council's behalf proves his/her point exactly.

Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Condate on November 24, 2015, 06:49:14 PM
It is good that councillors have full time jobs. That's the general idea. Councillors are supposed to be ordinary members of the public who give up some of their spare time to sit on the council and use their experience to the benefit of the borough. I'd much rather have a councillor with a proper job than a professional politician.

Obviously, having a full time job doesn't automatically make someone a good councillor and neither does being a professional politician of itself make someone a bad councillor. What I would like to see though are more councillors who are not members of any political party. That could certainly improve things, although it's not a guarantee of good local government.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: admin on November 24, 2015, 07:42:09 PM
Most drain blockage would have occurred over the past 3/4 weeks.

It's only a small aspect of this thread but (lack of) cleaning of drains in Marple has been a serious problem of neglect for at least a couple of years. There are drains in Marple, like the one on Hibbert Lane near the college, that have been reported to the council over and over again because the roads flood whenever there is a good downpour but they have done nothing about them - or they have tried and failed, which is much the same thing in my book.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on November 25, 2015, 11:07:39 AM
Hello Amazon,

Thank you for your vote of civic confidence, even though I think that you gave it tongue-in-cheek. Even if you were serious, for a variety of reasons I would be most unsuitable to stand for that role. So I am not the answer.

Franz,

Whilst as admin quite rightly says, the Station Rd/Brabyns gullies were only a small example to illustrate my point, I will respond to your assertion. You obviously do not walk regularly up/down those two roads as I do, otherwise you would not make such erroneous claims about ..."3/4 weeks." Those gullies have been in that state of malfunction now for at 3/4 YEARS, NOT WEEKS! I personally have reported them to the Council and so have others but the situation remains and when it rains heavily the road floods in a way that it never has before - those gullies need fixing - simple as that. As for your question about how many drains do I think there are in Stockport ?  I don't know and I don't care,for the purpose of my post I am only interested in those in Brabyns, Brabyns is local  and that's my point.

Simone is right, your post does read like an apology from the Council, perhaps you work for them, perhaps you have responsibility for the drains? 

As for Councillors getting ...'more votes than other candidates...' you are of course correct, and this is democracy. We should though also ponder upon candidates themselves. At the Lib Dem hustings for Marple North,(where I live) in 2014, the sole nominee could not even attend his own hustings because of 'work commitments.' In fact he sent his own wife along to deliver his speech, it was farcical. Normally such an absence, would have demonstrated such a blatant lack of commitment and interest that he would have been disqualified. Despite their search there was no other candidate, he was the sole applicant, so he was nodded through. Being a Lib Dem he won the election and is now one of our Councillors.

For years the Tories were so short of candidates for Marple that they fielded anybody that was prepared to stand, no matter what their credentials were. Many of these candidates had no connection to Stockport let alone Marple, they were just paper candidates. After the Marple election this year, one successful Tory Councillor announced that because of work commitments he couldn't attend his own surgery, which is every six weeks and for two hours on a Saturday morning. Now there is commitment for you.

Condate,

The points that you make about Councillors and jobs are well made. I have no first hand experience of being a Councillor  and I'm guessing that you haven't either. I do though have 2 relatives and 1 friend  who are/have been recent serving Councillors. All three of them say that it is now virtually impossible to reconcile the duties of a serving Councillor with a regular 9 to 5 job.

Your point about Councillor's and their parties is interesting. I would like to see more independent Councillors who didn't have to forsake their own wards to tow the party line.

With this in mind how do we in Marple break the stranglehold the Lib Dems/ Tories have over Marple, any ideas?   


 
     
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Dave on November 25, 2015, 01:00:27 PM
Our public realm is deteriorating for sure and I don't think that it has much to do with money. As Dave says, it isn't asking much to keep our parks in order.

Although I tend to agree with some of what Hoffnung writes, I think I need to explain my point about the modest cost of maintaining, upgrading or replacing childrens playground equipment -swings, roundabouts etc, and to explain why that is relatively 'cheap' compared with the cost of cleaning out blocked drains.

I'm no accountant, but I do know that local authority (and other organisations') spending comes in two broad categories: recurrent expenditure and capital expenditure.  Recurrent expenditure, as its name implies, happens continuously, and is accounted for within the financial year in which it occurs.  That includes all staff costs, of course.

Capital expenditure, on the other hand, such as investment in land or buildings or other assets which have a value, is accounted for over a number of years - at least five, and often more, depending on how long it is expected to last and retain value.

So if installing new swings were to cost, say £5,000, that cost would be accounted for over perhaps ten years, at £500 per year.  So it's cheap in terms of its impact on any one year's accounts. 

But clearing drains isn't capital spending, it's pay costs - you need staff to do it, and then keep doing it over and over again.  But local authorities have been shedding staff at a huge rate over the past five years, as cumulative government cuts of about 40% have continued to bite.  That's the main reaosn why the drains are overflowing!     
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 25, 2015, 04:03:05 PM
Dave's explanation makes sense, as his posts often do.

I would also like to support Hoffnung's reflection of the drains on Brabyns/Station Rd. Although not on foot I often travel up and down that hill, have done for many years. When it rains the drains overflow, they have been like that for 3 years at least, exactly as Hoffnung suggests. Dave infers that the council have probably stopped maintaining them because of the cost and he is probably right. Drains though are a fundamental and if we don't maintain them we know what happens.

Hoffnung can speak for him/herself but I took his main point to be the poor political representation that now exists in Marple. Hence why we have such drains and other such fundamental neglect.
 
I have long been a Lib Dem supporter but have become disillusioned with them of late. If an independent candidate were to present themselves at the next local election, then I would probably support them.

It is though hard to visualise one appearing and even harder to visualise them having any impact against the Tory/Lib Dem monopoly that exists in Marple.   
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: wheels on November 25, 2015, 04:37:32 PM
The points that you make about Councillors and jobs are well made. I have no first hand experience of being a Councillor  and I'm guessing that you haven't either. I do though have 2 relatives and 1 friend  who are/have been recent serving Councillors. All three of them say that it is now virtually impossible to reconcile the duties of a serving Councillor with a regular 9 to 5 job.

Your point about Councillor's and their parties is interesting. I would like to see more independent Councillors who didn't have to forsake their own wards to tow the party line.

With this in mind how do we in Marple break the stranglehold the Lib Dems/ Tories have over Marple, any ideas?

The current Leader of Stockport certainly had to give up a better paid job to becomeCouncil Leader as did the current Torry Leader of Trafford and of course the role as a Councillor is not pensionable so that makes it an even less attractive role for many people. The current leader could only really do it as she had built up a significant pension from 35 yrs employment and it came at the right time for her but I agree the current set up does limit those who can fulfil the role.

I think there is still a massive misunderstand as to the role of the councillor as redefined by government in the 1990. The role is very definitely NOT  to get involved in matter which should be dealt with by officer but is to set strategic objectives. Certainly deal with case work and report it if a drain is blocked then leave it to the professionals to deal with. The Councillors role is to set the agenda for the town their role and the 1950s role of the councillor are really now very different.

I believe I have moved your text outside of the quotes @wheels . Can you please take a bit more care to ensure you type below the end of /quote in []'s as you are doing it often and it's even harder than usual to figure out what you're saying! Admin
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: alstan on November 25, 2015, 05:08:36 PM
Hoffnung, how wrong can you be? I have regularly walked Brabyn's Brow, and to a lesser extent Station Road, for the past 36 years so much for it being "obvious" to you that I don't, and, to the best of my recollection, I  have never been inconvenienced by cascades of water.

So you think I might perhaps work for the council but perhaps I don't, never have done, and never will do, I just get annoyed at people who moan about the council but do little or nothing about it. There are those who get off their backsides and themselves endeavour to improve the "public realm" and they have my admiration and respect but there are others who do nothing but complain. Surely the place to air these criticisms and to get them remedied, is the council chamber? You obviously feel strongly about the situation so perhaps you should reconsider and offer yourself for election as Amazon suggests? You ask for ideas as to how to break the Lib Dems/Tories stranglehold and I can think of no other than for you and others of like mind to replace them.

Incidentally, when you next post please direct me to the Blair/Candler clash. I would very much like to see it. The agenda item would be fine.

Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 25, 2015, 06:06:44 PM
Franz, that is what this forum is often for, to promote discussion about local issues. Sometimes this involves praise and sometimes even criticism.

Just because we have an individual issue we can't all go haring off and stand for election. This forum is full of posts that are criticisms. We can't all be local councillors, there are only six in Marple and its population is over 20,000. If your remedy for everybody that has an issue is to stand for election, then maybe you should stand yourself, rid yourself of some of that annoyance on the campaign trail.   

This forum is often our council chamber and we are its elected members.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: wheels on November 25, 2015, 10:34:29 PM
The current Leader of Stockport certainly had to give up a better paid job to becomeCouncil Leader as did the current Torry Leader of Trafford and of course the role as a Councillor is not pensionable so that makes it an even less attractive role for many people. The current leader could only really do it as she had built up a significant pension from 35 yrs employment and it came at the right time for her but I agree the current set up does limit those who can fulfil the role.

I think there is still a massive misunderstand as to the role of the councillor as redefined by government in the 1990. The role is very definitely NOT  to get involved in matter which should be dealt with by officer but is to set strategic objectives. Certainly deal with case work and report it if a drain is blocked then leave it to the professionals to deal with. The Councillors role is to set the agenda for the town their role and the 1950s role of the councillor are really now very different.

I believe I have moved your text outside of the quotes @wheels . Can you please take a bit more care to ensure you type below the end of /quote in []'s as you are doing it often and it's even harder than usual to figure out what you're saying! Admin

Your correct admin many thanks for that.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on November 26, 2015, 10:36:05 AM
Hello,

It wasn't my intention that this post should become about drains on Brabyns/Station Rd. However things have a way of taking their own twists and turns. What I will say about those particular drains is that: They do not work, they haven't worked for 3/4 years, they have been reported over and over to the council and they still do not work. Staying with drains for the moment, I've just been on an errand in Marple and I took the opportunity (sad I know) to take a spin around the place and have a cursory inspection of the road gullies, in the rain. I would say that of the number I inspected at least half of them were blocked.

I have not heard anybody, or heard of any anybody from the Council state that they do not have the money to maintain our drains.

Right, enough about drains.

As Franz said if we have an issue we can always; stand for the council, get elected and air it ourselves in the council chamber. However, if only because of the equation that, there are only 63 Council positions in the borough and there are probably around 200,000 people eligible to stand for these positions, it is highly likely that the vast majority of people will never get that opportunity. So what can we do to resolve these issues that we have?

Well we can go go and bring these issues to the notice of somebody who does have this opportunity, Our Councillor.

Now I for one don't expect the Councillor him/her self to clear the drains (sorry don't mention drains!) personally, but I expect in due course  for something to be done about these issues or at least an explanation give as to why it can't be.

As I said in my initial post, our public realm in Marple is deteriorating and I and many others lay the blame at our political representation, which I repeat is at its worst and is about to get worse, after the next election. It is distracted, unfocussed or about to leave.

To return to Franz's environment of the Council Debating Chamber. As many of you know, we can now watch the Council meeting on the internet. If you do decide to do this, (God help us) you will see and hear endless hours upon hours of talk that has nothing to do with Stockport and certainly nothing to do with Marple and is nothing more or less than part politicking. This is from all parties; Conservative, Labour, Lib Dem. They are all as guilty as each other.

I have a question to put to this forum, where the real people appear. That's another point, I have been reading this forum for three years now and I may be wrong but I don't recall one posting from one single Councillor. I think that this is disgraceful. At least during the recent Parliamentary elections, the candidates had the decency to come on this site and state their case.

Sorry, a digression, back to my question.

If an independent candidate were to present for the forthcoming local elections, would you be prepared to vote for him/her?

And before Franz, proposes and seconds in one go - No it definitely won't be me. 

Fighting an election is an expensive business in many ways and initially, I just want to see if there is any support out there for such a situation.   

         
   
       
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: wheels on November 26, 2015, 11:06:11 AM
An independent!!!!!!!!!!!  ABSOLUTELY NOT NEVER.

There is a total misunderstand of some poster on the role of the Councillor in 2015.

Let me give an example. The Leader of Stockport Council this morning got a 6.30 train to London as she was giving evidence to a House of Lords Committee.  She is booked on to a 2pm train back to Stockport and then has a meeting with senior officers to discuss the impact on Stockport of yesterday's Commons statement. That's a 24% budget curt £4.1 billion in local government over this parliament.  Then it's on to a presentation event .....  Tomorrow she is at Trafford a Town Hall presenting the Housing Strategy for Greater Manchester  to the other 9 council leaders across Greater Manchester(as Leader of Stockport she is also responsible for housing and low carbon policy across Greater Manchester) ...... and so it goes on . This is normal for councillors independents have no role in modern local government.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: corium on November 26, 2015, 11:28:45 AM
independents have no role in modern local government.

The residents of Heald Green obviously feel differently with their independent ratepayer representatives. At a national level I seem to recall a very effective independent MP for Wyre(sp?) Forest whose constituents obviously had more faith in him than the other mainstream offerings.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Condate on November 26, 2015, 11:30:51 AM
An independent!!!!!!!!!!!  ABSOLUTELY NOT NEVER.

There is a total misunderstand of some poster on the role of the Councillor in 2015.

Then local government is broken. There is no room at all for party politics at council level. I think there is a real problem, in that the role of a councillor as you describe it, is not at all what I, or I suspect most people expect and deserve it to be. We need to be urging MPs to change the legislation to make councils what they are supposed to be.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 26, 2015, 12:35:48 PM
Wheels,

This time you've lost me completely.

There are hundreds of Independent Councillors the length and breadth of the country, probably around a thousand. We've got three in Stockport, who seem to get elected and re-elected year upon year. So their electorate must be happy with their performance.

How is an extract from a day in the life of Stockport's Council Leader an argument against having an Independent Councillor in Marple?

You say that ..."This is normal for Councillors..."

Are you trying to say that all Councillors get up at 6.30 am and travel to London. Then wizz back and give a presentation at Trafford and then develop  the housing strategy across Greater Manchester. I certainly hope that it isn't normal.

If that's the case no wonder the public realm in Marple is deteriorating.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 26, 2015, 12:58:14 PM
Hello,

It wasn't my intention that this post should become about drains on Brabyns/Station Rd. However things have a way of taking their own twists and turns. What I will say about those particular drains is that: They do not work, they haven't worked for 3/4 years, they have been reported over and over to the council and they still do not work. Staying with drains for the moment, I've just been on an errand in Marple and I took the opportunity (sad I know) to take a spin around the place and have a cursory inspection of the road gullies, in the rain. I would say that of the number I inspected at least half of them were blocked.

I have not heard anybody, or heard of any anybody from the Council state that they do not have the money to maintain our drains.

Right, enough about drains.

As Franz said if we have an issue we can always; stand for the council, get elected and air it ourselves in the council chamber. However, if only because of the equation that, there are only 63 Council positions in the borough and there are probably around 200,000 people eligible to stand for these positions, it is highly likely that the vast majority of people will never get that opportunity. So what can we do to resolve these issues that we have?

Well we can go go and bring these issues to the notice of somebody who does have this opportunity, Our Councillor.

Now I for one don't expect the Councillor him/her self to clear the drains (sorry don't mention drains!) personally, but I expect in due course  for something to be done about these issues or at least an explanation give as to why it can't be.

As I said in my initial post, our public realm in Marple is deteriorating and I and many others lay the blame at our political representation, which I repeat is at its worst and is about to get worse, after the next election. It is distracted, unfocussed or about to leave.

To return to Franz's environment of the Council Debating Chamber. As many of you know, we can now watch the Council meeting on the internet. If you do decide to do this, (God help us) you will see and hear endless hours upon hours of talk that has nothing to do with Stockport and certainly nothing to do with Marple and is nothing more or less than part politicking. This is from all parties; Conservative, Labour, Lib Dem. They are all as guilty as each other.

I have a question to put to this forum, where the real people appear. That's another point, I have been reading this forum for three years now and I may be wrong but I don't recall one posting from one single Councillor. I think that this is disgraceful. At least during the recent Parliamentary elections, the candidates had the decency to come on this site and state their case.

Sorry, a digression, back to my question.

If an independent candidate were to present for the forthcoming local elections, would you be prepared to vote for him/her?

And before Franz, proposes and seconds in one go - No it definitely won't be me. 

Fighting an election is an expensive business in many ways and initially, I just want to see if there is any support out there for such a situation.   

         
   
       

Hoffnung, is this pure speculation on your part or do you know something more than the rest of us?

Do you have a plan? Do you have a candidate? Who is it?
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Dave on November 26, 2015, 01:49:19 PM
The Leader of Stockport Council this morning got a 6.30 train to London as she was giving evidence to a House of Lords Committee.  She is booked on to a 2pm train back to Stockport and then has a meeting with senior officers to discuss the impact on Stockport of yesterday's Commons statement. Then it's on to a presentation event .....  Tomorrow she is at Trafford a Town Hall presenting the Housing Strategy for Greater Manchester

Perhaps wheels could provide some evidence for his implication that an independent councillor would be incapable of doing this? 
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: alstan on November 26, 2015, 06:57:29 PM
I don't look at this forum all that often but when I do too many of the posts consist of people moaning and whinging, very often about the council and our councillors, and seldom do they have anything constructive to say. This is a good example. Hoffnung's issue is hardly a single one, or if it is it's a very broad one, deterioration and disorder within the public realm coupled with totally inadequate representation. Three long posts full of criticism and not a single constructive comment, just one question, would we vote for an independent candidate? That rather depends on the quality of the candidate.

As far as my "environment" is concerned, I  have never been to a meeting of Stockport, or any other council, nor had I followed one online until Hoffnung invited his readers to witness the "clash" between Messrs Blair and Candler. I was certainly deterred when I found that the recording ran for more than four hours but it was possible through their efficient indexing to identify any discourse between two councillors. The only one I could find featuring those two contestant's comprised Mr Blair asking three reasonable questions and Mr Candler giving three reasonable answers, both in a calm and inoffensive manner. I had plenty of experience of clashes between local politicians during my time as a politically independent college governor and this just wasn't in the same league.

I am surprised that, after three or four years neglect, half the local drains are still effective. Those around our property need clearing at least every three months and, at this time of year, every week.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 26, 2015, 07:33:16 PM
So what exactly is your point Franz?

Are you saying that most people that post on this site are moaners and whingers? Are you saying that everything in Marple is as good as it ever has been, or perhaps better?

You mention the quality of the Independent Candidate who's identity we are yet unaware of, if indeed there is one at all. What do you think of the quality of our current candidates.

And the big issue, which I think Hoffnung makes. Has Marple had enough of Tories/Lib Dems.

Why do you continually apologise for the Council's shortcomings ?

       
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: wheels on November 26, 2015, 08:17:06 PM
The residents of Heald Green obviously feel differently with their independent ratepayer representatives. At a national level I seem to recall a very effective independent MP for Wyre(sp?) Forest whose constituents obviously had more faith in him than the other mainstream offerings.

The Heald Green Independents work fundementally as a political group and have a large membership. Candidates go through a selection process and are selected by the members they are not independents in the sense you mean at all. Further they work as a political group together with the other three political groups in the council
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: wheels on November 26, 2015, 08:18:29 PM
Then local government is broken. There is no room at all for party politics at council level. I think there is a real problem, in that the role of a councillor as you describe it, is not at all what I, or I suspect most people expect and deserve it to be. We need to be urging MPs to change the legislation to make councils what they are supposed to be.

Thankfully I totally disagree
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 27, 2015, 10:06:11 AM
Yet again you make a fair point about party politics and local government Condate.

I wouldn't place too much credibility in Wheels's definition of the role of a local Councillor. All on this forum know that he has a heavy, vested, personal pursuit in preserving the local political status-quo. His situation in local government terms would undoubtedly  be described as having..."a conflict of interest."  Even, bearing this in mind it is often beyond the wit of most of us, to decipher his philosophical, Joyceian,  meanderings.

As for your allegation Franz, that this forum is full of moaners and whingers. There are many amongst us I am sure ( I am such a one) who feel eternally grateful to the people who set up and manage this website, as it is the only vehicle that gives us the opportunity to engage with our neighbours in a free and candid interchange.

Neither should it go unmentioned that this forum was set up independently by our own neighbours in our own community and that the council (to their shame) have never made any kind of contribution to it.

Which once again reminds me. It has been said many times before, I know, but why in all the years, with all the vast and various issues that we have had in Marple, have our local representatives been conspicuous by their absence on this forum? It is nothing short of disrespect to their own electorate.

Perhaps with your IN position, you know the answer Wheels?

Even better, perhaps one of our six elected representatives, sitting out their could offer a view.

Or perhaps you do admin?   

 
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: hollins on November 27, 2015, 11:30:33 AM
Perhaps Wheels can explain Stockport Councillors' thought processes here:
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/residents-anger-stockport-council-extortion-10502860 (http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/residents-anger-stockport-council-extortion-10502860)
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on November 27, 2015, 02:35:04 PM
Yes I agree Simone, this forum is a fantastic piece of work an absolute asset to our community.

I disagree Franz, it is not full of moaners and whingers. On the contrary some of the posts are even quite entertaining.

I am not really in a position right now Simone to answer all your questions about forthcoming elections. What I can say is, no it is not pure speculation on my part. There is an idea by a small group of people to support the election of  'independent' candidates for Marple. It is recognised that this plan needs to be over a period and eyes are more on  2018/19 elections than on the next one.

It is also recognised that at least one candidate would have to stand in 2016. There area a few hoops to jump through yet, but it is hopeful that an announcement can be made in the new year and in good time for the 2016 elections.     
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on November 28, 2015, 11:45:26 PM
Hello,

Thank you,

To all whom supported my introduction to this website.

Our public realm is deteriorating for sure and I don't think that it has much to do with money. As Dave says, it isn't asking much to keep our parks in order.

There are numerous examples of this disorder. Here's one, I've just walked up from Marple Bridge to Marple. It was raining heavily, water was cascading down the road and I got drenched by the splash back from the passing traffic, it was unavoidable. Every other gully in the road was blocked. That's not lack of money, that's just lack of interest.

A new thread split from "Council Plans to remove "full time" staffing of Memorial Park". Admin.     

Hoffnung, have you ever reported this to one of your Councillors? I for one have never received a phone call, visit to my surgery or email from you concerning this topic. If you send me the details and who you have reported it to i can look into it for you.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on November 29, 2015, 12:31:51 AM
We've got another two who are brand new, one of these rookies has a full time job. We've got another who also has a full time job and apparently we've got one who has been in Oldham all week, helping his party with the forthcoming by-election.

As well as this, there is also the party politicking, which we are now getting, which only serves to be divisive. Don't take my word for this watch Cllrs Candler and Blair's clash at the last Council Meeting. Next year we will have even two more brand new Councillors and if the prospective Lib Dem candidates are successful then both these Councillors will have full time jobs. 

A new thread split from "Council Plans to remove "full time" staffing of Memorial Park". Admin.     

Yes, I am a new 'rookie' Councillor. I had no interest in politics until a few years ago. I was getting more involved with a local issue and saw the standard of representation on the Marple Area Committee which was firstly not representative of the society we live in and secondly, appeared to be a very comfortable committee. I thought I could do a better job, so put my money where my mouth was and was lucky that i was successful in being elected. I am sorry the job i am doing is not to the standard you want.
I do have a full time job, as much as I would love it to, the Councillor job does not pay the mortgage. As another contributor has already stated, Councillors are normal members of society who are there to hold the Council to account and provide strategic direction. Time management is the key and to question my commitment when you have never raised any issues with me directly or understand the work i do as a Councillor is a prejudgement of the highest order. You can ask my fiance and 3 month old baby about my commitment to my Council work when I spend most of my working week at my full time job only to spend most of the evenings at meetings within Town Hall or with residents or answering emails and conducting research, missing out on valuable family time! I am currently on a Development weekend in Nottingham, away from my family again and paid for out of my own funds to help me improve as a Councillor, because I am not a professional politician. Indeed responding to this post in this way is probably not in the professional politicians handbook!
Yes, I did miss one of my surgeries due to work commitments, but had this covered by my colleague. My job frequently involves international travel and as I said it is this that pays the mortgage. I will in fact miss my next one on the 7th Dec in High Lane as I will be in Hamburg, but you do not need to wait for my surgery, (which are held the 1st and 3rd Monday of every month, not every 6 weeks)  to raise issues with me. I dont expect or want you to feel sorry for me, it is my choice but do not question my commitment to representing the residents of Marple Area.
As for my alleged party politicing with Cllr Candler at the last Council meeting, we have an Executive Question time during full Council meetings. It must also be remembered that this meeting discusses all of Stockport, not just Marple. My first question to Cllr Candler was relating to the A6 MARR road, a considerable concern of residents in parts of my ward, which was raised by a local resident and had not been answered. I did my job and held the Executive to account. This was not politicing.
The second question was a follow on to that question relating to the lack of options available for mitigation as promised by the Council. As Cllr Candler is responsible for that area, a reasonable question to ask.
The third question related to another question asked by a resident which had been responded to but the response was dismissive and indeed incorrect, thereby potentially misleading the public. I was holding the Executive member to account, I did my job. This is not politicing.
If you do need assistance with anything, then by all means raise it with me directly by telephone, email or letter and I will certainly look into it on your behalf. All of my contact details are on the Stockport Council website.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on November 30, 2015, 12:16:28 PM
Hoffnung, have you ever reported this to one of your Councillors? I for one have never received a phone call, visit to my surgery or email from you concerning this topic. If you send me the details and who you have reported it to i can look into it for you.

It has been reported many times. The reason Councillor that you have probably never heard of the issue is because Brabyns/Station Rd is not in your ward. However feel most welcome to try and resolve it.

Furthermore, Thank you for responding to my post. In fact we have had a comparative, veritable explosion of posts from Councillors/Candidates recently. It is unprecedented  but a far as I am concerned most welcome.

As for your other post CllrKennyBlair, it is indeed interesting.

I though heard things slightly differently. This version was as follows: There was no other candidate so you were asked to stand. When you pointed out that you had a full time demanding job that involved international travel and that you just didn't have the time to fight an election or be a Councillor, you were told by your party managers that it didn't matter, you weren't expected to do much during the election, just show your face a bit in the last week, that you couldn't possibly win anyway that you were only what is known as a 'paper candidate,' and that you would be helping the party.

But of course win you did. I have mixed views on that result, but those views for another time. After you won, you realized that you couldn't undertake any daytime commitments. So the first thing you did was to inform your colleagues that you couldn't do your Saturday Morning Surgeries. They are on Saturday mornings for obvious reasons. There will be much you cannot do during the day which is vital to your role as a Councillor, only your constituents will not get to know about this. There is little that you can do about, if you've got to be in Hamburg, you've got to be in Hamburg. YOU CAN'T EVEN STAND DOWN, YOUR PARTY WON'T LET YOU, so your electorate will have to put up with the situation until 2019.

I don't doubt your well meaning and your commitment, I won't be asking your fiance or your three month old baby, as you suggest (I wish both of whom I well) for evidence of it, to ask the first would be an intrusion on your private life and to ask your child I would doubtless receive a childish answer.

I have no criticism of you, it is just that the first credential that a constituent needs from his/her Councillor is that he is there and you can't be.

If you look at the make-up of Councillors in Stockport, you will see that there are very few, if any at all, out of 63 who have traditional full time jobs, this is no coincidence and whilst you may have everything else that it takes to be a good Councillor, you don't have the time.           


In small example of this you  now inform that you have changed your surgeries to Mondays. Who is this to suit, your constituents?         
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: amazon on November 30, 2015, 02:29:46 PM
Hoffnung, have you ever reported this to one of your Councillors? I for one have never received a phone call, visit to my surgery or email from you concerning this topic. If you send me the details and who you have reported it to i can look into it for you.
You dont need to report it to local councillors just go on Stockport mbc website look for the revelent section that you want  fill the little box in and bingo its done .you can allso report
   faulty street lights just put you post code in it will even tell you the number of the light .that may be faulty .thought you would have known this Mr councillor . 

      over and out for now .
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on November 30, 2015, 05:56:23 PM
Thank you for the best wishes Hoffnung. Well what you heard must be true then and what I said couldnt be further from the truth.
I actually can make day committments and have done frequently. When I am not travelling, I work from home and work very flexible hours, so on that point you are incorrect.
I also did inform my colleagues that I couldnt or rather wouldnt do Saturday mornings. I wanted to do something differently, I have two suurgeries a month, one in marple and one in High lane which has been, in my opinion and those of some residents, sadly negelected by other Councillors.
I have been there for my constituents, ask those in High Lane where I managed to get the play park re-surfaced, or those on Windlehurst Road who have complained about speeding and the A6 MARR, the save middlewood way campaign, High lane residents Association, Hawk Green Residents association and so on. Your presumption that I cant be there is once again incorrect. As I said, Councillors are real members of society and to have every Councillor retired and not working does not represent the society we live in.
So please stop spreading these mis-truths and rumour. If you want to hear the real story, ask me through one of the many channels I have open -

twitter - @kennyblair77
Facebook - CllrKennyBlair
Website - http://marplesouth.yourcllr.com
E-mail - cllr.kenny.blair@stockport.gov.uk
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on November 30, 2015, 08:44:29 PM
Hoffnung/CllrKennyBlair,

I know little about the issues that you both debate except that 3/4  years ago I attended a meeting of the High Lane Residents Association, that the Councillor speaks of. If my recall is accurate the committee members outnumbered the attendees. So I don't think that putting their name forward is as any kind of endorsement at all.

Sounds to me Hoffnung as if you have some sort of agenda that you are not telling us about and sounds to me CouncillorKennyBlair as if you doth protest too much.   
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on November 30, 2015, 09:07:10 PM
Simonesaffron, merely pointing out the factual inaccuracies by Hoffnung and of course correcting their assertion that I am not committed as a Councillor simply because I have a full time job. It is not about the amount of time you spend on something but surely it is about getting results? Quality vs quantity. By all means judge me and the rest of the Councillors on our records when up for re-election but not after 6 months in the job and not solely because I have a full time job, but as you said, there may be some other agenda at play here.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: admin on December 01, 2015, 05:17:35 AM
You dont need to report it to local councillors just go on Stockport mbc website look for the revelent section that you want  fill the little box in and bingo its done .you can allso report
   faulty street lights just put you post code in it will even tell you the number of the light .that may be faulty .thought you would have known this Mr councillor. 
over and out for now .

Sometimes you can report things over and over again but nothing happens. At that point you should report it to a local councillor to chase up for you. I've done this a number of times, most recently when the new roundabout was installed the contractor left a load of heras fencing just outside the play area. It was loose and dangerous so I reported it to the Greenspace Team several times over a 2 week period and was repeatedly told it would be moved. It wasn't. Another volunteer also reported it several times via the council web site / phone. She was also told it would be removed. It wasn't.

So I reported it to Cllr Alexander on Saturday morning 7th November at the surgery in the library, she kicked some backsides and it was gone before the Remembrance service the following day. The response to her from the officer responsible: Oh, we thought it had been done!

So if you are not getting satisfaction via the normal route a councillor will often be able to kick the right backside for you.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on December 01, 2015, 08:27:43 AM
I had a similar experience a couple of years ago with some tyres that had been dumped. near the Roman Lakes.

Over three weeks, I reported it time and time again but nothing happened. So I reported the issue to a now former Councillor, I won't name him. I did it the same way you did Admin, Saturday Morning Surgery at the library.

As an aside CllrKennyBlair, one reason these surgeries are traditionally at the library on a Saturday Morning is so that members of the public know where to go if they need to speak to a Councillor face to face.

Anyway, come Tuesday midday, the tyres were gone.

There was a downside to this cosy LibDem coterie that had seemingly been around for years. But a definite upside was that collectively they had been around for years. It was hard to see any officer giving any of them the runaround. They knew the Council inside out and because they were the same politically the all advised and supported each other. Yes, in a lot of ways, a formidable political bunch in their day, the Marple 6.

After the next election, we'll have 5 Councillors who basically won't know who's backside(as admin calls it) to kick. Not to mention the party politicking which will obviously exist within the Marple group.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on December 01, 2015, 03:55:39 PM
I agree with you Simonesaffron, lets maintain the status quo, not challenge anything, never bring anyone new in to have new ideas or challenge the status quo or kick the backsides of those Councillors that may actually need it!

As for my surgeries, they have been well attended and surprisingly, not everyone can make a Saturday morning or make it to Marple Library. So i offer an alternative, which is well advertised, to those who cant make a Saturday by offering 2 surgeries every month (all other Councillors have 1 surgery every 6 weeks) in different locations (marple library and high lane village hall). But then, i am not committed or have the time!
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on December 02, 2015, 08:28:08 AM
There is a element of hysteria creeping into your posts CllrKennyBlair.

You know only to well that it has not been suggested that the status quo remain for all things neither has it been recommended that there should be no challenge nor no new ideas.

If you'd stop skirting around the issue and trying to pretend that you are doing something original and new and just plain and simple admit that you CAN'T DO YOUR SURGERIES ON SATURDAY BECAUSE YOUR WORKING, and that's the reason you have changed the day, it would be better thought of.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on December 02, 2015, 10:28:28 PM
Simonesaffron, so are you suggesting that I should lie that I can't do my surgeries on a Saturday because I work just to appease you? Well sorry to disappoint you. I don't work Saturdays, I work Monday to Friday and occasionally travel on a Sunday night. I have already stated the reasons why I have my surgeries on a Monday, but clearly you know my life better than I do, so I apologise if I was wrong.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on December 03, 2015, 08:10:03 AM
CllrKennyBlair,

Councillors surgeries have been going on for as long as I can remember on a Saturday morning at Marple Library. It is probably the case across the borough too.

If you need/want to speak to a Councillor face to face, you pop into the library between 10:30 and midday and there is a Councillor in attendance, it is as simple as that. Everybody in Marple knows it. it works perfectly well. There has already been two real examples on this thread (one from myself and one from admin) relating how benefit was derived from this. You come along and you want to change it, yet your Councillor colleagues stick by it. I would have thought that you would have been guided by your own more experienced colleagues on this.

Alright if it isn't because of your work commitments and it isn't change for the sake of it, you tell us why. The question shouldn't be too difficult to answer.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on December 03, 2015, 10:26:28 AM
CllrKennyBlair,

There is no point in us both ping ponging back and forth on this website until your next election in 2019.

I would though like to make reference to your reference to the Airport Relief Road and if that isn't what it is called then it should be. Everybody knows that this scheme is being driven by the airport in order to get more traffic to the airport and airport city. When The Airport says "jump" then Stockport Council says how high? This scheme has been openly promoted and supported over the years by both Conservative and Liberal Democrat politicians alike.

High Lane Village is just a casualty of this scheme and I feel sorry for the people of High Lane who are victims of what is sometimes known as collateral damage. All High Lane residents will get out of this scheme is more vehicular traffic and all its implications. Talking about 'mitigation' is a nonsense. All that will happen in mitigation is that a few hundred thousand pounds will be spent on some silly piece of cosmetic traffic management that will have no effect whatsoever. It is about time local politicians in Marple( both parties ) were honest with their constituents in High Lane and said that there is nothing that they can do as this road is outside their sphere of influence. Feeble, pointless questions about mitigation at Council Meetings is just party politicking by another name.

I will though Councillor make two concessions to you.

1/ You are quite right, judge you, against your period in office, not in the first six months. It is a fair point you make.

2/Whatever our disagreements, you are at least on her arguing your corner with energy. That has to be respected.

Where are the Liberal Democrats?

In fact who are the Liberal Democrats? 
     
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrKennyBlair on December 03, 2015, 11:18:19 PM
Hoffnung,

Thank you for your comments and concessions.

Simoesaffran, the question is not too difficult to answer, as I have explained my reasons for holding my surgeries on a Monday already, so you can re-read the posts. It is not my issue if you think you know better. As you said, the surgeries on a Saturday continue, so in actual fact, residents of Marple Area have more choice, not less. On that note, i shall leave this debate as we appear to be going round in circles.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: simonesaffron on December 04, 2015, 09:22:54 AM
I agree CllrKennyBlair and I will do likewise, but at least we have established the honest reason as to why it has been changed.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: CllrGeoffAbell on December 14, 2015, 10:00:45 PM
This is quite an interesting and intense thread.  I am a Lib Dem councillor, and my ward includes Brabyns Brow and Marple Memorial Park.
So a few comments:

1) Major roads are checked 4 times a year now.  This includes Brabyns Brow.  Less funds from central government means something does have to give.  There is £21m less next year, but the budget is not yet fixed, so please feel free to comment, here on my blog where there is more of a breakdown.  (Cllr Blair has commented - feel free to leave a comment too.)
http://marple.mycouncillor.org.uk/

2) I sat between Cllr Blair and Cllr Candler at the last full council.  Full council is quite long, so I applaud anyone who sat through it all.  The link to the webcast follows; the exchange between them is about 1 hour 45 mins in:
http://www.stockport.public-i.tv/core/portal/webcast_interactive/152572

3) However, we are making local democracy (in the form of Marple Area Committee) more accessible - more details soon for those that did not attend the extraordinary area committee.   

4) There are undoubtedly good councillors on all sides of the political spectrum.  And, quite probably, bad ones too.  But political philosophy and the place you represent does affect where you put the biggest emphasis. 

5) Someone quite rightly mentioned that I had to honour a contact in Amsterdam for IBM when I was chosen to represent the Lib Dems in Marple North.  But I consider that being a councillor IS a full-time job so I am here 100% since I was elected.  And this time, 5 wanted the job.

Please feel to contact me (or any other cllr representing Marple).
My email is cllr.geoff.abell@stockport.gov.uk, my cllr phone is 221-1766.
Title: Re: Deterioration of Public Realm and our local councillors
Post by: Hoffnung on December 21, 2015, 11:19:48 AM
Thank you Councilor Geoff,

For taking the time to offer your explanation about the road gullies.

I don't for one minute doubt your sincerity but I think that you are being misled. These road gullies are not being inspected 4 times a year and if they are then nothing is happening after that inspection. I agree, with less money 'something has to give,' but surely drains are fundamental.

We are bound to ask a question of our Council and our locally elected members.

If they can't devise,initiate implement and finance an operation that ensures our drains work, then what can they do, what are they for ?

Let me make a suggestion. I estimate that there are around 200/250 road gullies in North Marple although I don't actually know where North begins and ends and the same with south. Nevertheless, I'm sure that between you and Councillor Kenny, you have that knowledge.

What would it cost to have 250 gullies cleared, £1000, £2000, £3000?

As you and Councillor Kenny seem to be the only Councillors who talk to your electorate on this forum and as we don't seem to be able to get these drains done through Town Hall channels, why don't you and he devise a plan and pay for it out of local area committee funding? If my understanding is correct this is about £70,000 per year, so you should have plenty left over.

What do you say?

Anyway, I'll leave it with you, I'm off to the Canaries for a couple of weeks so Merry Christmas to all on the forum.